Considering to lease a Leaf

Hi,

Sorry if similar questions have been asked here many times before, but I'd like to get some reassurance if possible. I'm thinking about leasing a Leaf mostly to save on gas and to use the HOV lane (I live in California). Some more information: I work at Facebook in Menlo Park where they have EV charging stations. My one way commute is about 20 miles (so about 40 round trip).

Probably the biggest problem is that I only rent a house and therefore can't install a specific charging system and will have to go with the 110 Volt charging.

We currently have 2 cars, I use one exclusively for commuting and this is getting pretty old, so looking at replacing it soon. So basically I'm looking at driving 40 miles a day (or let's round up to 50) and I can charge for several hours at work and during the night at home. During the weekend I would probably also use the car from time to time to run errands, but for longer trips we'd always use our other car.

My thought is that with the $199 Lease currently available and with saving about $100 a month when comparing electricity costs to Gas costs that this sounds like a very good deal. Am I missing anything?

Thanks for any help!

You will be very happy with the car, the quietness, no vibration, fuel saves, and time savings. If you can reliably charge at work, you won't have to bother charging at home except for the weekends.
Make sure you shop around for the best deals. Call and email rather than showing up at the dealers who will make you wait for nothing.
This $100 down deal looks good:
http://www.boardwalknissan.com/specials/new.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I suggest you charge at home overnight, rather than absolutely count on doing it at work. If you have a good, tight outlet on a free circuit available this will save you from "range anxiety."

Look at http://www.plugshare.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It shows a lot of EVSE at FB, Menlo Park,, 2 or 3 at each building, some ChargePoint, some Blink, and a Blink CHAdeMO. Not many check ins, but you should scout them out and see how many are open every day. You'd be relying one one of them primarily. ChargePoints are generally more reliable than Blink.

Also look for stations near your home. Definatly get the QC package, you'll want the 6 kW charger.

L1, 120V, at home will be slow, but every little bit helps sometimes.

50 miles a day should be easily doable for the life of a lease.

The one thing I missed in my budget calculation was my leased LEAF has much higher insurance payments than the 9 yo beater ICE it replaced.

I have been using the L1 charger for 18 months. My commute is similar and L1 is ok.

woodgeek said:

The one thing I missed in my budget calculation was my leased LEAF has much higher insurance payments than the 9 yo beater ICE it replaced.

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Everyone thanks for the feedback! @woodgeek: Could you provide an estimate on how much higher the insurance payments are? I also have a 9 year old car that I want to replace and currently pay about $100 per month for insurance with pretty high coverage.

thetrb said:

woodgeek said:

The one thing I missed in my budget calculation was my leased LEAF has much higher insurance payments than the 9 yo beater ICE it replaced.

Click to expand...

Everyone thanks for the feedback! @woodgeek: Could you provide an estimate on how much higher the insurance payments are? I also have a 9 year old car that I want to replace and currently pay about $100 per month for insurance with pretty high coverage.

Click to expand...

This is hard to say exactly, because it's going to vary depending on so many factors, but I'll give you my situation as an example:

currently drive a 1999 ford crown vic. it's in great shape with low miles, but for insurance purposes it's a beater with a low rate.

purchasing a 2015 nissan leaf SV.

Currently pay $35.12 a month for full coverage with pretty high limits, 100k/300k, 100k property damage, 500 deductibles + rental car included, etc.

Upgrading to the Nissan, without any changes to my insurance it increases to $51.52 a month.

Approximately a 45% increase in my specific scenario.

Sounds like you will have a good fit.

The only bummer for level 1 only is not having a ton of range left after commuting home, and then wanting to do some trips in the evening. 110V charging adds 4-5 miles per hour, while having a 3.3 kW charge adds 12-15 miles/hour, or 25-30 miles per hour if you have the faster 6.6 kW charger.

Having access to charging at work should let you have decent range left in the evening. So charging at work would not be necessary, but on days you know you will be doing extra evening trips you can can make sure to get plugged in to top-up.

the wife pays the insurance....and i sometimes don't get a def answer. She said the bill went up $600, but I don't know if that is annually or twice annually.

thetrb said:

...
Probably the biggest problem is that I only rent a house and therefore can't install a specific charging system and will have to go with the 110 Volt charging.

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A repeat of my input from previous questions on 120 V EVSE use:
Note that Nissan recommends the 120V EVSE for limited emergency use only.
Some people have used it for a long time without problems yet, but in general that is a bad idea unless you have a newly properly installed dedicated circuit with high grade receptacle using properly tightened screw connections.

Previous info from another thread:

mikelb said:

...
Trickle charging should be safe, though, right? I wouldn't necessarily need to have the circuit certified for it or anything, should I? If I were to go to a friend's house, would I be safe plugging into their outlet?

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How safe 120V charging is depends on how lucky you are.
Very few garages have the correct properly installed high quality single outlet supplied by a single breaker.
Code only allows using 80% of the circuit rating for a long term continuous load.
So on a 15 amp circuit nothing else should be on the same circuit while the car is charging.
And a lot of 120V gets put in poorly using push in connections.
One person had a bad fire most likely from staples that had damaged the cable in the wall.
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=15784&hilit=+fire#p352567" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

thetrb said:

Could you provide an estimate on how much higher the insurance payments are? I also have a 9 year old car that I want to replace and currently pay about $100 per month for insurance with pretty high coverage.

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Shop around for insurance. Some insurance companies don't mind the Leaf, others treat it like the plague and price the premiums accordingly.

Regardless, replacing a 9 y/o car (which is presumably liability-only) with a new one (which will require comp/collision if financed or leased) is of course going to drive up your insurance premiums. How much is going to vary by insurer, and just because your neighbor with the identical car(s) got a low rate with one company doesn't mean you will too.

I've exclusively used the 110V EVSE that came with my Smart Fortwo Electric Drive.

The EVSE has been plugged in to the same outlet for 1 year, without any issues.
I only charge at 12A 110V, which is the same amount of current my electric lawn mower uses.
If you trust the outlet with a lawn mower, the EVSE at 12A will work fine too.

The corded electric lawnmower uses power for much shorter periods, and you are there, monitoring it. I do agree, though, that the concerns can be overstated. You don't need a brand new circuit with just one outlet on it, for example. You need a circuit in excellent condition, with no other *significant* loads on it. (A lower wattage light or a low-amperage "wall wart" would be fine, for example.) A new outlet isn't a bad idea, but if it is not at all worn, that too is optional.

I disagree w/Tim's far too paranoid statement (IMHO). However, yes, there can be dangers (e.g. aluminum wiring (http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=10887" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false, loose outlet, Zinsco or Federal Pacific panels (http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=283829#p283829" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false. It is important to periodically monitor the outlet, esp. on the first charge.

My only means of charging at home is L1 w/the stock 120 volt EVSE. But I hardly charge at home, mostly only on weekends (if it all). I have free L1 and L2 charging at work. Most of the L1 outlets at my work are on a 20 amp circuit and the outlet and my L1 EVSE's plug barely get warm from extended charging there.

SmartElectric said:

I've exclusively used the 110V EVSE that came with my Smart Fortwo Electric Drive.

The EVSE has been plugged in to the same outlet for 1 year, without any issues.
I only charge at 12A 110V, which is the same amount of current my electric lawn mower uses.
If you trust the outlet with a lawn mower, the EVSE at 12A will work fine too.

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Electric lawn mower doesn't draw 12 amps for MANY hours on end and isn't run unattended. You're actively stopping and starting the mower and at least somewhat near the outlet, in case trouble develops. We're talking about charging at 12 amps unattended for as much as ~20 hours straight, pulling full power for much of it.

Well, that's a bummer. I'm a bit concerned because I know that the electric circuits on the house we're renting are pretty old and not in great condition. I'm wondering if there's anything I can do about that as a renter which doesn't have me invest a lot of money in the house when I'm thinking about moving next year anyhow.

thetrb said:

Well, that's a bummer. I'm a bit concerned because I know that the electric circuits on the house we're renting are pretty old and not in great condition. I'm wondering if there's anything I can do about that as a renter which doesn't have me invest a lot of money in the house when I'm thinking about moving next year anyhow.

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If one of the outlets is fairly near the breaker or fuse box, it isn't hard to pull a new cable along the same path, replacing the old outlet at the same time. If there are other appliances on the circuit but an empty slot in the panel or an empty fuse, the new cable could become a new circuit. If it's simple a good electrician can do it quickly. Some will try to gouge you for an easy job, so shop around.

thetrb said:

Well, that's a bummer. I'm a bit concerned because I know that the electric circuits on the house we're renting are pretty old and not in great condition. I'm wondering if there's anything I can do about that as a renter which doesn't have me invest a lot of money in the house when I'm thinking about moving next year anyhow.

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How costly or difficult it is all depends on the details.
Could be simple and landlord might do it.
Or could be very costly.
There is a lot of discussion in a thread in late October about an old ungrounded wiring situation.
Here is link where I commented on that one:
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=18340&hilit=fire&start=20#p396669" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;