Introducint and Newbie Question (B-mode)

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gotd77

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 27, 2014
Messages
64
Hello everyone!
I am Ted and i have 2015 S Leaf. no QC. I was able to get lots of help from this from about having questions with L2 charger.
Now, when do you guys use B-mode on your leaf? (if your leaf equip)
i read about it and it should recharge battery and i kind of get it when coasting or breaking but it seems very complecate to manage.
How do you guys drive your leaf? for example i do lots of free-way drive...

thank you

Ted
 
My car doesn't have B-mode, but I would use it anytime I wanted additional/more aggressive regenerative braking. EG: long downhill runs, or wanting to slow to a stop without using the brakes much (though I can do that pretty effectively in ECO too).
 
mwalsh said:
My car doesn't have B-mode, but I would use it anytime I wanted additional/more aggressive regenerative braking. EG: long downhill runs, or wanting to slow to a stop without using the brakes much (though I can do that pretty effectively in ECO too).

Thank you!

I was even more confuse after known function of ECO mode.
some one told us in the forum said with out ECO mode actually holds mileage better because it coasting better on the down hill or free way... so i am testing every day in different mode...actually 4 differetn ways...D with ECO mode and without and B mode with witout ECO mode.

thank you

Ted
 
On the early Leaf's Eco mode limits the AC/heat power consumption, makes the gas pedal less sensitive to make driving slow easier, and it kicks in stronger regen braking when you lift off the gas pedal.

They split this function in later models to be B mode for stronger regen braking, and Eco mode for the AC/Heat and pedal response.

Use B mode on gentle hills, or if you just prefer doing more single pedal driving, and less feathering of the brakes to come to a slow stop to maximize the amount of power you recapture with the regenerative brakes.
 
mwalsh said:
The difference is going to be climate control - there are energy savings from limiting CC output in ECO (and probably ECO + B) that are not applicable with D (or D+B).

so what is be best way drive to saving miles?

ted
 
gotd77 said:
so what is be best way drive to saving miles?
For information on efficient driving (hypermiling) you might want to take a look at Stoaty's Guide to Energy Efficient Driving of the Leaf.

Driving efficiently has less to do with using B mode or Eco and more to do with how you drive. But one advantage of Eco is that the accelerator is mapped at constant power: if you hold the pedal at the same position you will get the same power, whether 10 kW, or zero (the equivalent of neutral), or whatever. The aggressive acceleration mapping of D makes efficient driving more difficult. It is easier to accelerate gently in Eco and keep at a reasonable speed. This helps with more efficient driving.

One concept that newcomers to EVs don't usually get is that more regen is not always better. Coasting is more efficient under most circumstances than regen braking because regen is somewhat inefficient. But if you need to slow or stop, regen is much better than using friction brakes. So: coasting > regen braking > friction brakes. Ideally, you want to use as little braking as possible and travel at a constant speed, where practical. And, of course, slower speeds are much more efficient than higher speeds because aerodynamic drag (friction) increases at the square of velocity.
 
dgpcolorado said:
gotd77 said:
so what is be best way drive to saving miles?
For information on efficient driving (hypermiling) you might want to take a look at Stoaty's Guide to Energy Efficient Driving of the Leaf.

Driving efficiently has less to do with using B mode or Eco and more to do with how you drive. But one advantage of Eco is that the accelerator is mapped at constant power: if you hold the pedal at the same position you will get the same power, whether 10 kW, or zero (the equivalent of neutral), or whatever. The aggressive acceleration mapping of D makes efficient driving more difficult. It is easier to accelerate gently in Eco and keep at a reasonable speed. This helps with more efficient driving.

One concept that newcomers to EVs don't usually get is that more regen is not always better. Coasting is more efficient under most circumstances than regen braking because regen is somewhat inefficient. But if you need to slow or stop, regen is much better than using friction brakes. So: coasting > regen braking > friction brakes. Ideally, you want to use as little braking as possible and travel at a constant speed, where practical. And, of course, slower speeds are much more efficient than higher speeds because aerodynamic drag (friction) increases at the square of velocity.

thanks for helpful info.
I was driving no ECO with just D mode...it coasting but still reduce speed repidly even it was down hill...i guess friction is too strong even it was D mode...i don't use B mode less and less because it will almost complete stop if i use it. something wrong with my car???? longest time i ever coasting was 3 second...depends on traffic but around 3 sec with D mode 2 second with B mode...otherwise call will honk me and tail gating me...because speed reduce very quick and there is no stop light from me so driver's get mad. so i figure just D mode with very light touch and 3 second cost with no a/c and no heat. that is what i know so far. I don't know anyway B mode is ever helpful. if i live in hilly area then it might help on going down..but you will re use going up lol.
 
B mode is best for traffic and for twisty roads where you'd be applying the brake a lot. Eco is usually better for normal type driving if you want economy.

They split this function in later models to be B mode for stronger regen braking, and Eco mode for the AC/Heat and pedal response.

NO, Eco mode also provides more Regen than D mode. It just isn't as aggressive about it.
 
LeftieBiker said:
B mode is best for traffic and for twisty roads where you'd be applying the brake a lot. Eco is usually better for normal type driving if you want economy.

They split this function in later models to be B mode for stronger regen braking, and Eco mode for the AC/Heat and pedal response.

NO, Eco mode also provides more Regen than D mode. It just isn't as aggressive about it.

OK, so with ECO and B together should be better for economy? I really need to learn how to get good range...
I have done just D, D+ECO,and B.
they all seemed same to me...
 
OK, so with ECO and B together should be better for economy? I really need to learn how to get good range...

They are best together in stop and go or accelerate & brake type situations. In situations where you want to coast a bit while slowly losing speed, Eco is best if you use the climate control, and D is best if you don't and can apply the "gas" gently.
 
gotd77 said:
mwalsh said:
The difference is going to be climate control - there are energy savings from limiting CC output in ECO (and probably ECO + B) that are not applicable with D (or D+B).

so what is be best way drive to saving miles?

ted


This has started many arguments on here..... B will not give you more range, many other things can be done to give you more range. There are some drivers who don't want to do those other things. They then say that when they use B they get more range than had they been driving "normally" without B.

The way to get the best range is to take as little out of the battery as possible, it's that simple. Try to drive to maximize your miles/kWh. Pump your tires up to the max (44psi for the stock tires, cold inflation, pump them beyond after a drive then park the car all night and in the morning let air out untill they are where you want them). Slow down 5 mph less than your normal driving. You'll be surprised how people aren't pissed off at you and how the slow lane has a lot of people who are happy to go just under the speed limit.

Use the power use gauge in the carwings section of the nav screen. The big round gauge on the left is power. Whenever you don't need to go faster hold the pedal so you are using only as much power as possible. Going down gradual hills on the highway (or off ramps), hold it at 0. If you're going towards a known stop and there's no one close behind you coast early at 0 power use/regen instead of cruizing steady and hitting the brakes. If it was for a red light because it takes you longer to get there there's a greater chance it will turn green, then you get to accelerate from a higher speed vs driving up to the light and maximizing regen. In that shorter time you may have come to a complete stop and you also used more energy maintaining that speed to get close to the light. Going up gradual hills on the highway let the speed drop a bit and keep the power use low.

You'll notice how you can use 80kW to go and only about 1/3 of that to regen. If you play around with the various modes, eco B, eco D, D, B you'll find that with control of your right foot you can do all the same stuff at almost the same time. Some modes will give you more regen with a simple lift without touching the brakes and the other modes will give you the same regen with a slight tap of the brake that isn't hard enough to activate the calipers. I prefer that because it will put your brake lights on for safety and since driving efficently means slowing down a lot sooner than most other drivers would it's good to have the brake lights on.

People will carve wood with hand tools and with chainsaws, with practice you could master one or both but just because someone else has mastered one doesn't mean that it's better than the other.
 
LeftieBiker said:
OK, so with ECO and B together should be better for economy? I really need to learn how to get good range...

They are best together in stop and go or accelerate & brake type situations. In situations where you want to coast a bit while slowly losing speed, Eco is best if you use the climate control, and D is best if you don't and can apply the "gas" gently.

Dealer blame on me when I complane mileage issue that i was attamp to use climate control or cruise control...what??? Im confuse
 
minispeed said:
gotd77 said:
mwalsh said:
The difference is going to be climate control - there are energy savings from limiting CC output in ECO (and probably ECO + B) that are not applicable with D (or D+B).

so what is be best way drive to saving miles?

ted


This has started many arguments on here..... B will not give you more range, many other things can be done to give you more range. There are some drivers who don't want to do those other things. They then say that when they use B they get more range than had they been driving "normally" without B.

The way to get the best range is to take as little out of the battery as possible, it's that simple. Try to drive to maximize your miles/kWh. Pump your tires up to the max (44psi for the stock tires, cold inflation, pump them beyond after a drive then park the car all night and in the morning let air out untill they are where you want them). Slow down 5 mph less than your normal driving. You'll be surprised how people aren't pissed off at you and how the slow lane has a lot of people who are happy to go just under the speed limit.

Use the power use gauge in the carwings section of the nav screen. The big round gauge on the left is power. Whenever you don't need to go faster hold the pedal so you are using only as much power as possible. Going down gradual hills on the highway (or off ramps), hold it at 0. If you're going towards a known stop and there's no one close behind you coast early at 0 power use/regen instead of cruizing steady and hitting the brakes. If it was for a red light because it takes you longer to get there there's a greater chance it will turn green, then you get to accelerate from a higher speed vs driving up to the light and maximizing regen. In that shorter time you may have come to a complete stop and you also used more energy maintaining that speed to get close to the light. Going up gradual hills on the highway let the speed drop a bit and keep the power use low.

You'll notice how you can use 80kW to go and only about 1/3 of that to regen. If you play around with the various modes, eco B, eco D, D, B you'll find that with control of your right foot you can do all the same stuff at almost the same time. Some modes will give you more regen with a simple lift without touching the brakes and the other modes will give you the same regen with a slight tap of the brake that isn't hard enough to activate the calipers. I prefer that because it will put your brake lights on for safety and since driving efficently means slowing down a lot sooner than most other drivers would it's good to have the brake lights on.

People will carve wood with hand tools and with chainsaws, with practice you could master one or both but just because someone else has mastered one doesn't mean that it's better than the other.

Thank you for your tip. I wanted to utilize all function on ly leaf and B mode seems useless so i was curious what the real deal was and how to use then correctly. I am on the high way pretty flat road...most of the times. so B really doesnt help me i figure what you think?
 
gotd77 said:
LeftieBiker said:
OK, so with ECO and B together should be better for economy? I really need to learn how to get good range...

They are best together in stop and go or accelerate & brake type situations. In situations where you want to coast a bit while slowly losing speed, Eco is best if you use the climate control, and D is best if you don't and can apply the "gas" gently.

Dealer blame on me when I complane mileage issue that i was attamp to use climate control or cruise control...what??? Im confuse

Dealers are the last people to ask these questions, believe me. Yes, using climate control does reduce range, but if your car has the heat pump and it isn't frigid out the reduction is small - usually two miles for a typical trip. Using cruise control usually helps. It can hurt a little in some circumstances, but not a lot.
 
gotd77 said:
thanks for helpful info.
I was driving no ECO with just D mode...it coasting but still reduce speed repidly even it was down hill...i guess friction is too strong even it was D mode...i don't use B mode less and less because it will almost complete stop if i use it. something wrong with my car???? longest time i ever coasting was 3 second...depends on traffic but around 3 sec with D mode 2 second with B mode...otherwise call will honk me and tail gating me...because speed reduce very quick and there is no stop light from me so driver's get mad. so i figure just D mode with very light touch and 3 second cost with no a/c and no heat. that is what i know so far. I don't know anyway B mode is ever helpful. if i live in hilly area then it might help on going down..but you will re use going up lol.
If I understand what you said correctly, you aren't really coasting when you are in D mode. By "coasting" I mean using zero power and no regen braking. If you are D and just back all the way off the accelerator you will get some regen braking (unless you are at 100% charge); that's how the car is designed. And that is less efficient than coasting unless you really need to slow down for some reason. I hope that is clear because it is very important to understand.

One way to coast is to shift into neutral (but be aware that you won't have any regen until you shift back into D or Eco, nor can you accelerate in neutral, for obvious reasons). Try it sometime when there is no traffic around. To shift into neutral hold the shifter to the left for one to two seconds and an N will appear on the dash instead of a D.

The other way to coast is to hold the car at zero kW with the accelerator pedal. But the S model doesn't have an energy gauge that you can use to determine this, unlike the SV/SL models. The best you can do in the S model is to keep the car at one dot on the dash (no regen dots to the left, no acceleration dots to the right). But this is a very crude gauge. Holding the equivalent of neutral — zero power — is MUCH easier to do in Eco because of the way the accelerator pedal is mapped: if you keep it at the same position it will hold the same power, regardless of your speed. In D mode the accelerator pedal is acceleration mapped, which makes it very difficult to hold zero kW (the equivalent of neutral) or drive efficiently with gentle acceleration. People who prefer D mode tend to be interested in "spirited" driving, which is the opposite of efficient driving (hypermiling).

Since you have the S model, the only sure way to coast is to shift to neutral, where it is safe to do so. Otherwise you will have to do the best that you can by "feel", using the accelerator. This is easiest to do in Eco, as I said above.

As for B mode, it does have uses other than descending hills. When slowing to a stop you can switch into and out of B mode to adjust the amount of regen you are using. I find this fun, sort of a game to see if I can come almost to a complete stop without using the brake pedal. But most people likely can't be bothered with adjusting regen this way, and that's ok.
 
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