Confused about charging

Seriously looking at the LEAF, but I'm confused by what I was told at the dealership yesterday, so I want to review charging options. The LEAF S I was looking at had two connection ports - the Quick Charge and the Standard. The QC port is 480V and is useful for those times when you want to recharge to 80% of capacity in 30 minutes. You can find this QC stations at Nissan dealers and various other places.

The other port is the 240V standard connector. Based on my research, I need a 40A service (I know it only requires 30A, but I want some extra) in the garage. Is this the Level 2 charging?

Finally, I was told by the salesman that I can plug in a 120V line but it would take noticeably longer to charge, no surprise there, but I did not see the connector for the 120. Where is it?

I was going to ask about battery life, but since I'm leasing, it's not an issue.

Appreciate the feedback.

The 110 volt port is the same connection as the 240 port. The Leaf comes standard with the 110 volt charge cable. In order to use 220 you either purchase a additional cable, or send in the one that comes with the car for modification. I just drove a Leaf earlier this week on a extended test drive.

cgilley said:

Seriously looking at the LEAF, but I'm confused by what I was told at the dealership yesterday, so I want to review charging options. The LEAF S I was looking at had two connection ports - the Quick Charge and the Standard. The QC port is 480V and is useful for those times when you want to recharge to 80% of capacity in 30 minutes. You can find this QC stations at Nissan dealers and various other places.

The other port is the 240V standard connector. Based on my research, I need a 40A service (I know it only requires 30A, but I want some extra) in the garage. Is this the Level 2 charging?

Finally, I was told by the salesman that I can plug in a 120V line but it would take noticeably longer to charge, no surprise there, but I did not see the connector for the 120. Where is it?

I was going to ask about battery life, but since I'm leasing, it's not an issue.

Appreciate the feedback.

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cgilley said:

The other port is the 240V standard connector. Based on my research, I need a 40A service (I know it only requires 30A, but I want some extra) in the garage. Is this the Level 2 charging?

Finally, I was told by the salesman that I can plug in a 120V line but it would take noticeably longer to charge, no surprise there, but I did not see the connector for the 120. Where is it?Appreciate the feedback.

Click to expand...

Yes, that is Level 2 charging. Yes, you can install a Level 2 EVSE (Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment) in your garage, and yes you probably want to use one that provides up to 30 amps to maximize the charging speed so you'll need a 40 amp breaker. EVSEs are running $400-600 these days and can be found at many on-line sites including Home Depot. Installation costs depend on your situation - if you have an electrical panel in your garage and it has capacity for the 40A breaker installation costs will be low. You can also use level 2 charging at many public chargers - plugshare.com has a map of them.

Level 1 uses the same port as level 2 - the difference is that you are charging from a standard 110/120 volt outlet using the EVSE cable that comes with the LEAF. Level 1 takes 13-14 hours to charge from near empty to 100%. Level 2, if you have the full 30 amps, takes under 4 hours with most 2013 and later LEAFs. (Earlier LEAFs, and some 2013 and later LEAFs with S trim didn't have the QC port so also had a slower level 2 charger.) If your public charging station has only 16 amps (as many do) or you have one of the LEAFs with the slower (3.6 kW/h) on-board charger then a full charge from near zero takes about 7 hours.

You can have your LEAF EVSE cable modified to provide either level 1 or level 2 charging, depending on the power source. It can thus plug into, for example, an electrical dryer outlet or an RV campground outlet. This won't be quite as fast as a full 30A level 2 EVSE. See evseupgrade.com. Search this forum and you'll find lots of very positive comments about this option.

thanks guys. Not too worried about finding uber high capacity chargers - level 2 at 230V is more than good enough. This will be a tootle around local spots (basically family taxi service, short trips to the store, etc).

I'm going to save myself 1800 and skip the QC. I just won't need it.

cgilley said:

I'm going to save myself 1800 and skip the QC. I just won't need it.

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IIRC the L3 option also includes the 6 kW on board charger (L2) upgrade from 3.3 kW standard.
Even with 3.3 kW you will still charge overnight just fine. Any boost during the day will be about half speed.
Also for 3.3 kW you only need 20 amp circuit and 16 amp EVSE. Larger circuit is fine but no faster unless you get the 6 kW L2 charging.

Maybe 2015 options are different.... Just make sure you know what you are getting.

cgilley said:

thanks guys. Not too worried about finding uber high capacity chargers - level 2 at 230V is more than good enough. This will be a tootle around local spots (basically family taxi service, short trips to the store, etc).

I'm going to save myself 1800 and skip the QC. I just won't need it.

Click to expand...

Before you make that decision, I would check on PlugShare.com to see how many quick chargers there are your area, particularly in distant (30-50 mile) away places you sometimes like to go. Make sure to enable "High Power Stations" on the upper right corner of the main page, and disable everything but "CHAdeMO" and "J1772" in the settings under "Outlets (Local)." If you are planning to get the EVSE Upgrade, or a plug-in dedicated 240 volt EVSE, you can also enable "NEMA 14-50" to give you additional charging options.

Occasionally this forum will get asked if it's possible to add QC later, and the answer is for the most part "no." You probably could go to your local Nissan dealer and order enough parts to make it happen, but that's akin to buying a V-6 Mustang and later deciding you should have bought the V8 after all. It may be possible to swap in a similar-year V-8 engine, but certainly not economically feasible.

One thing people find when they get a Leaf is that they start to use it as much as they can over any ICEVs they continue to own, due to its economical cost of operation as well as its silent powertrain. Quite a few people lease their Leafs for only 12k miles a year and quickly realize they didn't purchase enough miles up front, because they thought they only use their cars for "local" errands and commuting. For some it becomes a personal challenge to see how far they can take their cars (with TonyWilliams' run along the entire length of the west coast being a rather extreme example).

Even if there are zero QC's within 100 miles of your home, as mentioned earlier the S with QC option also comes with a faster on board charger. It may not be beneficial when charging at home, but in areas where there are no QC's, it could shave off time sitting at a public L2 station trying to get enough juice to make it to your destination.

cgilley said:

thanks guys. Not too worried about finding uber high capacity chargers - level 2 at 230V is more than good enough. This will be a tootle around local spots (basically family taxi service, short trips to the store, etc).

I'm going to save myself 1800 and skip the QC. I just won't need it.

Click to expand...

I'd say this package is a good buy. Just because you won't need it doesn't mean you will never find a time to use it. Also when you end up selling your leaf you don't want to omit something that a buyer might need. That could impact the used value, so the true cost to you may not be $1800 in the long run.

If you ever have to stop someplace to charge an L3 is only a few min, an L2 at 3.3 vs an L2 at 6.6 could mean a 1hr wait vs 2hrs. As the vehicle ages and you have less capacity this may matter more and more.

minispeed said:

I'd say this package is a good buy. Just because you won't need it doesn't mean you will never find a time to use it. Also when you end up selling your leaf you don't want to omit something that a buyer might need. That could impact the used value, so the true cost to you may not be $1800 in the long run..

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This is an excellent point. I've been browsing used LEAFs for a while now as a possible replacement for our 2012 lease and automatically omit from consideration any without the QC. In addition, I've started looking for only 2013 or later because I want the 6.6 kw/H charger instead of the slow L2 charger. In the process I've heard that it is much harder to sell a used LEAF without a QC.

As more people get familiar with the LEAF and EVs in general - and as the availability of public charging stations grows - these options will grow in demand. Many first-time LEAF buyers plan to use only the basic L1 charging and, yes, that can work if you just want to use the LEAF for a single commute per day, for example, and use a gas car for the other trips. But soon most LEAFers find they love driving an EV and want to use it as often as possible. So they get the L2 installed at home and start perusing Plugshare to see how many other trips can be done with the LEAF. After a while they start planning a weekly trip in the gas car just to make sure that it gets adequate use as everything else is being done in the LEAF.

I will echo what others have said about the QC port. Our first leaf didn't have it. At that time there were no QC stations in town, so I felt it didn't matter. But now there are. And when we got our second Leaf we made sure it had the QC port. Without that QC port, your Leaf will be anchored to an area with a radius of around 35 miles from your home. If your area has QC stations, then you will have almost the same freedom as a gas car to go anywhere in town you want to go.

cgaydos said:

...Level 1 takes 13-14 hours to charge from near empty to 100%. ...

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Actually a full charge is closer to 20 hours with Level 1. 5% capacity per hour is a good rule of thumb for Level1 charging.

Nubo said:

cgaydos said:

...Level 1 takes 13-14 hours to charge from near empty to 100%. ...

Click to expand...

Actually a full charge is closer to 20 hours with Level 1. 5% capacity per hour is a good rule of thumb for Level1 charging.

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True, but how often do you truly get that close to zero on charge? My "empty" is typically 20% SOC.

I'd encourage the OP to try and look out 5 or 10 years here. When you have a second EV, or one with double the battery capacity. You'll want higher charging capacity sooner or later, so why mess with wiring everything more than once?

And yes, a 2015 S without the QC option only has the 3.3kW charger. Even though I have no QC available in my area, I wanted the QC option because I see the lack of infrastructure as a short-term issue. Also, public L2 charging can generally handle the 6.6kW that is supported when you have the QC option installed.