About to "Purchase"

Hey guys I'm new around here. I have been considering a Leaf for my wife for several months. Closest experience we've had was a prius(non-plug-In). We are well aware of the range limitations of the Leaf. In addition, I understand the rationale as to why most Leaf drivers choose to lease oppossed to purchasing.

With that being said, I am considering buying one as there is a deal I cannot refuse. If my rationale is flawed please feel free to express your opinion.

Semi-local Nissan store is offering me a new 2013 S Base(no quick-charge) for $22,700 plus tag transfer plus sales tax putting me right at $24,300 Out the door. Next year on my 2014 taxes I could claim the $7500 tax credit bringing the effective purchase to $16,800. What a deal!!!!!

OK first and foremost, is the 3.6kw charger going to annoy me? This is the last Leaf on this dealers lot and no one in the state can touch this price. My wifes typical route each day is 49 miles all total so on about 95% or her driving the Leaf will suit us fine. We have two other gas vehicles in our house so when she needs to make a longer trip she will have options.

I'm assuming a 240Vac 30amp(I'd buy a 30amp since the next car may require it even though I understand the 3.6kw only really requires 16amp) charger will re-charge a fully depleted battery in what about 7 or 8 hours??

So, I guess two questions asked is this a good price making a "purchase" a sound decision? And secondly, is the 3.6kw charger a bad choice no matter how good the price?

Craig

That price and the term "tag transfer" concern me. Make sure this car is new, not used, and has not been previously registered. You must be the original owner to claim the tax credit. At that price, I'm wondering if they used it as a loaner or if it belonged to an employee, or such. If so, you couldn't claim the tax credit.

Dealer verified this is a new car. Tag transfer is the cost to registering a tag already in my name.

Craig

Happy Wife = Happy Life - how much extra for the SL or SV + QC?

Base model S - has no QC, no Cruise Control and no remote access capability via phone or web.

Move to GA - get 5K extra tax credit!

Great. I don't think the 3.3kW charger will be much of an issue. After all, all of us '11 and '12 owners had no better, and it will easily charge the car overnight. It does make public charging less useful.

Sounds like a Great Deal, my 13 SL was 10K more.

For me I hate beige interior, I hate Cloth, I needed Leather.

I wanted fog lights and 17" Aluminum wheels.

I use my iPhone App every single day to check my Range and pre-heat the LEAF.

Just some things to think about.

Sal

Make sure it doesn't have any Miles on it.
My dealer has a loaner that has never been titled, but it has 6200 miles on there.
Tax credit requires NEW new car (less than 500 miles I think max)

It's a great price.
(I would want the larger charger, and the QC port, and leather, but its a price threshold thing.
Good luck
2 years, and I still get a kick out of mine every day.

Where you will notice the best benefit with the faster OBC is when you are using a public L2 charging station in order to reach your destination. The faster unit will cut down your wait time, but ONLY if the charging station delivers more than 3.8 kW. Some public Blink units don't for example, due to overheating problems at higher amperages.

If you charge at home overnight, you won't notice a difference in usability. If you use L1, there is no difference at all.

Sounds like a good deal. We have a very similar situation with wife driving the car 50 miles round trip each day. For all the grumbling in the early days about having 3kw instead of 6kw charging now that 6kw is readily available you don't hear many people raving about how it has changed their lives. As davewill points out, unless you are heading back out with less than 5 hours of sleep in the routine situation it won't matter.

IMO it still might be interesting to see if that deal could translate into an equally good lease deal for the following reasons:
- get the $7500 now
- no question about getting the $7500 for your tax situation
- depending on the numbers, it could be like a zero % interest three year car loan
- guaranteed resale value at the three year mark if you change your mind for any reason

Either way, $16,800 for a new car with a warranty is a good deal. For one that costs practically nothing in fuel and maintenance you may have found the best deal in the history of western civilization.

KillaWhat said:

Make sure it doesn't have any Miles on it.
My dealer has a loaner that has never been titled, but it has 6200 miles on there.
Tax credit requires NEW new car (less than 500 miles I think max)

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Nope. Just needs to have never been titled.

I do hear the rumor about mileage limits to what is "new" from different sources, but the key tell is that everyone quotes a different mileage number. Perhaps there was such a rule long ago, but not now.

However, there are situations where dealers title a car or buy it back. Run a VIN check ... You don't have to pay for the check, just see if the service reports more than 2 records on that VIN.

On the other hand, when buying a dealer loaner/demo ask explicitly if the car has a date for being put into service. Often it has .. And that is the date the warranty clock starts even if it has not been titled yet.

KillaWhat said:

Make sure it doesn't have any Miles on it.
My dealer has a loaner that has never been titled, but it has 6200 miles on there.
Tax credit requires NEW new car (less than 500 miles I think max)

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What defines a "new" car will vary by state. In California, the cutoff I think is 7000 or 7500 miles. I bought a dealer-demo '98 Maxima with 6950 miles on it, but because it was never titled it could be sold as new. Nissan at the time was offering $2k off unsold '98 Maximas so with some hard bargaining I was able to get $4k total off sticker, and because it was considered new, I got a superior interest rate over a used car.

cgaydos said:

On the other hand, when buying a dealer loaner/demo ask explicitly if the car has a date for being put into service. Often it has .. And that is the date the warranty clock starts even if it has not been titled yet.

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Very true. My Maxima's warranty was shortened by 6 months and 6,950 miles for that reason.

49 miles round trip even with heating etc. on and cold weather should be doable but barely. I go 42 miles with a good bit of highway on an 80% battery and have a few miles left. Probably 80-85% highway. High winds can hurt too if you're driving into them. Higher tire pressures and slower speeds help a nice bit.

Winter and heating on will challenge a 49 mile round trip at highway speeds IMHO. As the battery wears out, even more of a concern. I use pre-heat to warm the car before I drive it, and then a heated seat pad so I don't use the heater much for just me.

I have an SL tho so I use the app for climate control ahead of time.

If she could find an ordinary 110V outlet at work she could do it easily. You can get about 5 miles of range back per hour back. So 7 hours a day gets you 35 back. Easy.

I am getting an EVI EVSE which should add 30% more speed to the 110V charge rate. The Nissan unit is only 12 amps. This is 15-16.

QC is nice but not a must have if you plan accordingly.

Here, the EVGO plans are more expensive than I think is worth it for DC capability anyway. I got the $60 yearly unlimited L2 and $9.95 per use DC for emergency use.

On that note I have Blink, EVGO, and Chargepoint network capability.

Wife has a Toyota Tacoma but I've had to use it rarely.

240V at home makes trips after work, weekends, etc. better. You get abut 12 miles of range per hour back.

I would double, and triple check, your eligability for the $7,500 credit. When I was looking for my Leaf, one of the dealers assured me that I could take the $7,500 credit even though I was leasing it. He was wrong. The price sounds like pretty much what you would get if the dealer took the credit.

If in fact you can get the car for that price, it is a great deal and I would take it. But you will at some point wish you had the bigger charger and the Quickcharger. Without the QC, you pretty much can't charge on the road unless you are stopping overnight, or for a long, long meal. Still, for all the money you are saving, you could take a limo for those occasional trips.

So after buying new cars for the last 30 years these dealers never seize to amaze me with creative B.S.

After more than a dozen e-mail messages with this dealer I phone them before making the 1 3/4 hour drive each way. When I pin them down to the final OTD number I need to fund they inform me......No this is a lease. HOW CAN THIS BE A LEASE as it lists the price clear as day and even states you must finance through nissan or lose rebates.....Firkins Nissan is a joke.

Sorry for the misinformation I posted earlier. Guess I'm still Leaf-less.

Craig

Craigmri said:

... HOW CAN THIS BE A LEASE as it lists the price clear as day and even states you must finance through nissan or lose rebates.....Firkins Nissan is a joke. ...

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A lease is always based on a sales price, and it's subject to the same negotiation as when buying. That said, it sounds like they deducted the $7500 tax credit from the price they advertised to you, since that would be credited to a lease at the time of purchase. If you purchase it, they have to add that back to their advertised price since you wouldn't get it until later.

That's why we all thought it was too good to be true.

I don't know where you are, but I had probably my best ever car buying experience at DeCournier Nissan in Manchester (Northeast) Connecticut. Did almost all the discussion, negotiation and payment on line or phone. I went in there once for 10 minutes so they could evaluate my trade-in, then came back to pick up the car.

I have heard very good things about Marlboro in central Mass and Bennett in NW Connecticut looks good too. All three seem very familiar with the Leaf and offer free charging to anyone.

Craigmri said:

...HOW CAN THIS BE A LEASE as it lists the price clear as day and even states you must finance through nissan or lose rebates.....Firkins Nissan is a joke....

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If this is Firkins Nissan 1611 Cortez Rd W Bradenton, FL 34207, then you will need to worry about temperature-induced battery capacity loss. Until Nissan gets the "hot" battery out, with a 50 mi RT, I would only lease in Florida.

Reddy said:

Craigmri said:

...HOW CAN THIS BE A LEASE as it lists the price clear as day and even states you must finance through nissan or lose rebates.....Firkins Nissan is a joke....

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If this is Firkins Nissan 1611 Cortez Rd W Bradenton, FL 34207, then you will need to worry about temperature-induced battery capacity loss. Until Nissan gets the "hot" battery out, with a 50 mi RT, I would only lease in Florida.

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Yes is was Firkins.....I wouldn't recommend this outfit.

Craig

cgaydos said:

On the other hand, when buying a dealer loaner/demo ask explicitly if the car has a date for being put into service. Often it has .. And that is the date the warranty clock starts even if it has not been titled yet.

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Apparently, the warranty clock doesn't start until once you purchase a demo from Tesla Motors. I guess this is one of the practices Governor Christie feels compelled to protect consumers from.