Question: Cold weather, plugged in heating and trickle charg

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M

Murali

Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2012
Messages
7
Hi All,

On cold nights when it gets near freezing:

1. When the car is plugged in to a normal charging unit (220v, blink) in the garage, is it advisable to turn the climate control on and leave it running all night to ensure that the batteries are protected from the cold?

2. Is it better to trickle charge at 110v instead, so that the battery charging activty will keep it warm?

-M
 
Murali said:
Hi All,

On cold nights when it gets near freezing:

1. When the car is plugged in to a normal charging unit (220v, blink) in the garage, is it advisable to turn the climate control on and leave it running all night to ensure that the batteries are protected from the cold?

2. Is it better to trickle charge at 110v instead, so that the battery charging activty will keep it warm?
Click to expand...
I would not turn CC on to protect the battery. If your LEAF is a MY2012, it has a battery heater to protect it from freezing. The battery does not freeze at 32F - the built in heater comes on, as I recall, at -4F and stays on until something higher - 15F? If your car is a MY2011 without the battery heater,don't be concerned about low temperatures until it gets well below the freezing point of water.

Some like to charge just before laving in the morning, thereby getting a bit of heat in the battery. Use an end point timer to do that.

Bill
 
The CC also will only keep on for a max of 1 hour while plugged in (15 minutes unplugged I believe). CC in the morning and that will help bring the battery to a better temperature.

Level 1 generates much less heat, and unless its charging right up to when you leave, the battery will cool down anyways. If you concerned about having your battery at the best nominal temperature use an end timer so your car will charge only late at night and finishing right before you leave.

Honestly, charging, unless QCing, does little to heat the battery. I have never gotten an extra bar of heat on the temp guage from level 1 or 2 charging (although that temp gauge has very wide "bars"). The battery won't get hurt from the cold weather (unless it hits the minuses in F), so in the end its just about getting more range out of your car. As stated previously, if its a MY2012, it has a heater to prevent to freezing damage.
 
I concur, DO NOT turn on the CC, as it will do nothing to heat the battery. The best way to keep a battery warm is by charging. I'd set an end charge timer and plug into your Blink. The charging will warm up the battery plenty by the time you are ready to leave.

You should also set a climate control timer to activate after the charge timer completion time.

If you are observing reduced range, one of the big reasons is that the climate control is probably using it while driving. See my Climate Control Upgrade thread for more information.

-Phil
 
I need to have 100% charge and also want to heat car.
I only have access to trickle charge at work.
If I charge to 100% and then turn on heater remotely will the draw be sufficient to heat but not draw down battery.
range is more important than heating.

it is about 55 degrees where car is parked. in shade.
 
thankyouOB said:
I need to have 100% charge and also want to heat car.
I only have access to trickle charge at work.
If I charge to 100% and then turn on heater remotely will the draw be sufficient to heat but not draw down battery.
range is more important than heating.

it is about 55 degrees where car is parked. in shade.
Click to expand...
If you are plugged into 120v, then the heater may draw a little off the battery, but in general it just heats slower. Just be sure to leave your CC on long enough to recover any energy lost.

-Phil
 
I've never "pre-heated" at 55F (sorry that's normal "warm" spring up here), but I doubt you would draw more than the 1.2 KW max allowed on L1. At lower temps, yes, I pull 1.2 KW from the cord and the rest from the battery when using pre-programmed CC. However, I often leave at variable times so I frequently just start charging, push the ON button twice without my foot on the brake, set the heater to 90 F and let it go until I'm ready to leave. In this case, the max heat is only 1.2 KW and nothing is drawn from the battery. This works great for those who don't have a smart phone. Unfortunately, below 20 F, there isn't really enough heat generated to get the car temp much above 60 or 70 F (although I haven't measured it).
Reddy
 
ebill3 said:
The battery does not freeze at 32F - the built in heater comes on, as I recall, at -4F and stays on until something higher - 15F?
Click to expand...

Battery will freeze around -30C. Heater comes on at -20C (-4F) and turns off once heated to -10C (+14F).
 
thankyouOB said:
I need to have 100% charge and also want to heat car.
I only have access to trickle charge at work.
If I charge to 100% and then turn on heater remotely will the draw be sufficient to heat but not draw down battery.
range is more important than heating.

it is about 55 degrees where car is parked. in shade.
Click to expand...

I trickle charge (L1) my car and I've been pre-heating it in the mornings before I head out the door. I don't notice any appreciable loss of range by doing it that way. I just usually turn on the CC remotely via my phone 1/2 hour before I leave. Gives it plenty of time to warm up the cabin and my range appears to be about the same as usual too. YMMV. You might want to test it on a non-work day just to be sure since range is important to you.
 
vrwl said:
thankyouOB said:
I need to have 100% charge and also want to heat car.
I only have access to trickle charge at work.
If I charge to 100% and then turn on heater remotely will the draw be sufficient to heat but not draw down battery.
range is more important than heating.

it is about 55 degrees where car is parked. in shade.
Click to expand...

I trickle charge (L1) my car and I've been pre-heating it in the mornings before I head out the door. I don't notice any appreciable loss of range by doing it that way. I just usually turn on the CC remotely via my phone 1/2 hour before I leave. Gives it plenty of time to warm up the cabin and my range appears to be about the same as usual too. YMMV. You might want to test it on a non-work day just to be sure since range is important to you.
Click to expand...

I am the furthest from an expert on this with the experience of around 500 miles on my Leaf but....

I have charged to 100%, then turned on the CC remotely from my phone before expecting to leave, and my car was toasty warm in 30 minutes in my 38 degree heated shop. My results were the same as "vrwl". That said, I would have not way of knowing if I took away any expected mileage by doing so.
 
i am using verison 1 of EVSE upgrade (charges at 12 amps) and i will say that despite the message that states I am charging from line power, i do lose charge from the car.

several times, I check SOC and had GID count of say 275. preheat, then come out and start up and gid count is now 263 or something. this has been repeated several times.

this is one reason why I dont recommend preheating any longer than is necessary. yes, your car will retain heat longer if you heat soak it for like 30 minutes but I think its really counterproductive to what we are trying to achieve.

I tested it and using remote start (and assuming carwings is responding normally) I can heat up a car sitting in mid 20's temps to a comfortable level in 6-8 minutes. I can make it downright warm in 10-12 minutes.

if parked in your garage with temps running from 50's to maybe near 30º (hard to say since all garages have different levels of insulation, heat retention, etc) your heating needs would be less.

i think what is happening is that level of power needed initially outruns the line power even at 16 amps for a short period of time until the power draw levels out which means that you could simply stay on preheat until the car regains that lost power but in my experience the charge cycle is not restarting
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
i am using verison 1 of EVSE upgrade (charges at 12 amps) and i will say that despite the message that states I am charging from line power, i do lose charge from the car.

several times, I check SOC and had GID count of say 275. preheat, then come out and start up and gid count is now 263 or something. this has been repeated several times.

this is one reason why I dont recommend preheating any longer than is necessary. yes, your car will retain heat longer if you heat soak it for like 30 minutes but I think its really counterproductive to what we are trying to achieve.

I tested it and using remote start (and assuming carwings is responding normally) I can heat up a car sitting in mid 20's temps to a comfortable level in 6-8 minutes. I can make it downright warm in 10-12 minutes.

if parked in your garage with temps running from 50's to maybe near 30º (hard to say since all garages have different levels of insulation, heat retention, etc) your heating needs would be less.

i think what is happening is that level of power needed initially outruns the line power even at 16 amps for a short period of time until the power draw levels out which means that you could simply stay on preheat until the car regains that lost power but in my experience the charge cycle is not restarting
Click to expand...
Obviously, it depends on the ambient temperature and EVSE power, but I assure you that if you remotely start CC and leave it running long enough, you can increase the SOC of the battery. My experience is with a 240V 32A EVSE (Blink; of course, the car is only drawing 16A). At high-40s, low-50s temperatures, starting after an 80% charge (10 bars), if I pre-heat for an hour, I will often end up with 11 bars. One time, I was delayed and the pre-heat ran 1.5-2 hours and I ended up with 12 bars!
 

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