EPA: Nissan Leaf gets 99 mpg equivalent

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The Environmental Protection Agency, which tests vehicles for emissions and fuel efficiency, determined the Leaf’s official range to be 73 miles on a fully charged battery, considerably less than the 100 miles previously claimed by Nissan.
What?
 
BruinLEAFer said:
The Environmental Protection Agency, which tests vehicles for emissions and fuel efficiency, determined the Leaf’s official range to be 73 miles on a fully charged battery, considerably less than the 100 miles previously claimed by Nissan.
What?


Plus this statement "Adding to any confusion they might feel, the Leaf will have a second sticker, from the Federal Trade Commission, displaying the car’s range as 96 to 110 miles."

I guess we are in for a lot of spin from both the positive and the negative numbers coming out. I believe this is just going to add to the FUD that is already out there about the LEAF.
 
BruinLEAFer said:
The Environmental Protection Agency, which tests vehicles for emissions and fuel efficiency, determined the Leaf’s official range to be 73 miles on a fully charged battery, considerably less than the 100 miles previously claimed by Nissan.
What?

Driving the Volt as EPA did this test probably will give it a range of of 10 to 15 miles instead of the claimed 40 miles.

Let the Leaf be in normal client hands and they will see if the LEAF will reach the 100 miles easy or not.
 
So if I am doing the math right EPA is saying the following about the Leaf:
106 MPGe city, 92 MPGe highway and 99 MPGe combined.
Using the 33.7 kWh per gallon formula gives us:
3.145400593 miles per kWh city, 2.729970326 miles per kWh highway and 2.93768546 miles per kWh combined.
Resulting in kW-hr/100 of:
31.792452835 city, 36.630434788 highway and 34.04040404 combined.
Rounded the Leaf would be 32 city, 37 highway and 34 combined.

The 2002 Rav4 EV was listed as 27 city and 34 highway. Is the Leaf really less efficient than the Rav4 EV or did the testing change?
 
Spies said:
Is the Leaf really less efficient than the Rav4 EV or did the testing change?
Sort of answering my own question I see that the 2002 Rav4 EV numbers I mentioned are before the 2008 changes. http://www.fueleconomy.gov/ does not seem to have the updated numbers for any of the EVs either. Hard to compare the Leaf epa figures with any other electric at the moment.
 
Spies said:
Is the Leaf really less efficient than the Rav4 EV or did the testing change?

The EPA MPG testing changed from the year 2008 onwards to take into account much more aggressive driving habits.
I remember that the 2007 Carolls got I think 40MPG why, and then the 2008 Carolla got 36 I think..

So, yes the testing is different now.

I also wonder with the 2008-onwards EPA tests, if much of the test was conducted with a cold ambient temperature and thus using the Resistive heater of the climate control system a lot.. That resistive heater can draw over 4,000 watts from the battery pack.. and if the heater was in heavy use during the tests then the MPG should be more like 110 or 120 MPGe..imho!

If all you have to do is bundle up in a heavy coat and gloves to get 20 more miles on a charge on a winter day...


Where did you get the figure of 4 KW and what heater are you mentioning?
 
How are the tests done? Is the car on a course or is it hooked up to a machine?

If it's the latter - it would seem that the car wouldn't be able to regen.
 
Copying over information from some of my posts from the locked thread on the Main section (where this should be because it is not about "Charging Equiptment")

also, if you crunch the numbers,

73 miles of range/(99 mpge /33.7kWh per gallon of gasoline)= ~25 kWh of useable battery capacity

on Autoblog:
http://green.autoblog.com/2010/11/22/ni ... a-sticker/

While it may not make any difference in the real world, i think the 73 number is going to cause some people some problems...

However, in the press release, the LEAF is officially classified as a mid-sized...
 
Is the ratings based on charger efficency?. Gas mileage is based on engine efficiency. We measure what goes in and measure what we get out and run the numbers.
So this might mean a 73% efficency if going from 99 to 73?
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
Is the ratings based on charger efficency?. Gas mileage is based on engine efficiency. We measure what goes in and measure what we get out and run the numbers.
So this might mean a 73% efficency if going from 99 to 73?

99mpge is based on 33.7kWh equivalent in a gallon of gasoline. The LEAF does not have 33.7kWh of useable battery capacity (although it is likely more than the 24kWh they have been stating)

Chances are the 73 miles of range is lower than others have experienced because EPA tests with climate control on and adds a number to devalue their test results for inefficient driving habits of many people. However, as electric motors are more efficient (presumably effecting the devalue rating), aircon/heating takes a larger portion of energy, and many people may pre-heat/cool on grid power, those ratings may not be very representative of what drivers experience in real life.
 
I think it would be helpful to see what the current Dynomometer test suite specifically entails on a second-by-second (10 Hz?) sample rate with speed, temperature, etc.
 
Interesting but that would be in reverse. If the Leaf did have the 33 kwh it would presumptuously go 33% farther not 25 % shorter.... am I missing something here?
 
Ok read last post and it a bit vague. Now we are talking a rating and not capacity. So if a Leaf can do 100 miles on 24 kwh or the equivalent of about 73% of a gallon then it mpg rating would be higher not lower
 
lne937s said:
DaveinOlyWA said:
Is the ratings based on charger efficency?. Gas mileage is based on engine efficiency. We measure what goes in and measure what we get out and run the numbers.
So this might mean a 73% efficency if going from 99 to 73?

99mpge is based on 33.7kWh equivalent in a gallon of gasoline. The LEAF does not have 33.7kWh of useable battery capacity (although it is likely more than the 24kWh they have been stating)

Chances are the 73 miles of range is lower than others have experienced because EPA tests with climate control on and adds a number to devalue their test results for inefficient driving habits of many people. However, as electric motors are more efficient (presumably effecting the devalue rating), aircon/heating takes a larger portion of energy, and many people may pre-heat/cool on grid power, those ratings may not be very representative of what drivers experience in real life.

The Leaf has 24 kwh or usable energy, it would never go 100 miles on 19kwh and Nissan would never cycle the pack to 0 if the total were only 24 kwh. I'm betting it's near 30 or and actual 30 kwh, I'm sticking to that prediction. I'm also betting the Leaf pack voltage of 400V is boosted like the Prius and IS NOT the actual pack voltage. After careful inspection of the contactors and packaging they are far too close and not designed for 400V. This makes complete sense for a 10K rpm motor and to eliminate sag and increase efficiency. And the Leaf charger is not that inefficient and contrary to what the misinformed Nissan people say it is behind the back seat not behind the inverter, that's a voltage booster likely. In fact the Leaf parts look identical to the Prius Denso parts and connectors in the Pack. Now I'm way off topic.
 
Well I have experienced 6-9% greater numbers over the EPA in my Prius. I don't plan to change my driving habits so that gives me near 80 miles. I am good since that still covers my "wish" of at least 70 miles under most conditions.

To be honest with ya. Tired of waiting and talking.I wantto find out for myself. I am ready to start driving and that time is a coming! !
 
EVDRIVER said:
The Leaf has 24 kwh or usable energy, it would never go 100 miles on 19kwh and Nissan would never cycle the pack to 0 if the total were only 24 kwh. I'm betting it's near 30 or and actual 30 kwh, I'm sticking to that prediction. I'm also betting the Leaf pack voltage of 400V is boosted like the Prius and IS NOT the actual pack voltage. After careful inspection of the contactors and packaging they are far too close and not designed for 400V. This makes complete sense for a 10K rpm motor and to eliminate sag and increase efficiency. And the Leaf charger is not that inefficient and contrary to what the misinformed Nissan people say it is behind the back seat not behind the inverter, that's a voltage booster likely. In fact the Leaf parts look identical to the Prius Denso parts and connectors in the Pack. Now I'm way off topic.
Agree about the >24kWh capacity. At a recent DriveTour, a Leaf engineering type (not one of the "Disney ride operators") said he couldn't divulge the total pack capacity to me but put it above 28 less than 30. Interesting about the pack boost. Wouldn't that interfere with the 400VDC QC scheme? Or do you suppose it's a reason why QC has to be done at the factory; cables run the length of the vehicle and pack boost has special electronics?
 
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