Does (D)rive and (R)everse seem backwards to you?

Ok, this is probably a silly thing, but when I sat down in the Leaf for the first time and put it in "gear", it seemed counter-intuitive to have to push the joy stick forward to go backwards and backwards to go forward. I know it was set up like this to resemble an automatic transmission in an ICE car, but even with that, it still seemed like it was backwards to me.

Anyone else feel the same way?

pasowino said:

Ok, this is probably a silly thing, but when I sat down in the Leaf for the first time and put it in "gear", it seemed counter-intuitive to have to push the joy stick forward to go backwards and backwards to go forward. I know it was set up like this to resemble an automatic transmission in an ICE car, but even with that, it still seemed like it was backwards to me.

Anyone else feel the same way?

Click to expand...

I know exactly what you mean. It got me confused sometimes, too.

The reason is because it doesn't mimic the ICE car layout completely. If it does, there should have been the Park position up front, then R, then N, then D. This way nobody gets confused.

But instead they move the Park from the traditional up front position to the middle position, aligned horizontally with N. This is no longer the traditional layout, and this new layout causes people to start thinking that the car direction should follow the shift direction.

yes - but 20 minutes later it felt perfectly normal

2 months later though I occasionally mess up locking and unlocking the doors - it's just weird not having a key

It doesn't take me long to get used to arbitrary controls.
I don't recall making any mistakes with the Leaf shift puck, and basically after looking at it once when I first got in the car, I just started using it without thinking about it.

Yes, logically some part of me wants to think that pushing forward to go forward would be 'better', but I don't think it matters that much.

Besides, there is a precedent / history of auto trans cars having reverse forward, and drive backwards...

Yes! #2 on my list of things to hack!! Bugs the crap out of me.

Reason: I've never driven an automatic car. All my cars before the Leaf have been stick. Even if I had driven automatic previously, the rest of the car is so new, why would I need to stick to the positions of a traditional transmission??

It's so intuitive to push the nub forward to go forward--this one really bugs me (in case you couldn't tell?)

And #1 is having to repeatedly accpet carwings, of course...

The Toyota 5 speed has R toward the rear of the car, the F250 4 speed has
R toward the front. I mostly get it right. But I agree, it's bass ackwards.

What really drives me nuts is that the brake release on the Ford is the
same as the hood release on the Toyota. :x

When you are in a deep chair, and you want to move yourself forwards out of the chair, you can push backwards on your cushion to go forward. If you think of the puck like that - you are grabbing it to pull the car forward, it makes a bit more sense.

By the way:
http://www.tomsguide.com/us/rowheel-wheelchair-propulsion-system-redesigned-wheelchair,news-8195.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This has come up on Priuschat before. See http://priuschat.com/forums/gen-iii-2010-prius-main-forum/84047-shifter-d-should-forward-motion-r-should-backward-motion-4.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

It has also been discussed here:
One week ago
Three months ago

Ray

bradleygibson said:

Yes! #2 on my list of things to hack!! Bugs the crap out of me.

Click to expand...

Great, let me know when you successfully hack it!

planet4ever said:

It has also been discussed here:
One week ago
Three months ago

Ray

Click to expand...

Thanks Ray, I've had miserable luck with the search function on the forum. I usually get nothing or stuff that's not what I'm looking for. Maybe I don't understand the logic that the search page is looking for. :?

Same here, can never find things using that search.

FYI The widespread adoption of PRNDL can be traced to a chapter in Ralph Nader's book "Unsafe At Any Speed." It discussed an alternative to the then-prevalent automatic shift pattern that was dangerous primarily due to human factors. This chapter advocated widespread adoption of the PRNDL pattern.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unsafe_at_Any_Speed#.22Disaster_deferred.22" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

BTW I use to see an old Corvair driving around San Diego; its plate: NADER1 :lol:

pasowino said:

Thanks Ray, I've had miserable luck with the search function on the forum. I usually get nothing or stuff that's not what I'm looking for. Maybe I don't understand the logic that the search page is looking for. :?

Click to expand...

Perhaps you are using the wrong search box. Did you see this message:

Annoyed with the standard search on this forum? Use Google powered My Nissan Leaf search:

and the box immediately below it which says "Google™ Custom Search"? Type your query in that box.

By the way, I did mess up. The second link I showed was to a thread that started a year and three months ago.

planet4ever said:

pasowino said:

Thanks Ray, I've had miserable luck with the search function on the forum. I usually get nothing or stuff that's not what I'm looking for. Maybe I don't understand the logic that the search page is looking for. :?

Click to expand...

Perhaps you are using the wrong search box. Did you see this message:

Annoyed with the standard search on this forum? Use Google powered My Nissan Leaf search:

and the box immediately below it which says "Google™ Custom Search"? Type your query in that box.

Click to expand...

Search is still pretty broken here on MNL and using Google instead doesn't necessarily help. See http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=5286&p=125928#p125928" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

I wonder if anyone's going to fix the search here at MNL. With the Google search, one can only do so much (i.e. somehow get Google to crawl (re-crawl?) the entire site).

After years of driving a Prius, it seems perfectly natural to me. Maybe they figured that most people buying one would be Prius converts...

My favorite backwards control is the e-brake flapper? Pull on it to engage - why not push like any other electronic control. Pulling a lever to activate something is so 1903.

Edit: figured it out - so the loose puppy in the front seat won't step on the e-brake control and launch the car into a tailslide.

DeaneG said:

My favorite backwards control is the e-brake flapper? Pull on it to engage - why not push like any other electronic control. Pulling a lever to activate something is so 1903.

Edit: figured it out - so the loose puppy in the front seat won't step on the e-brake control and launch the car into a tailslide.

Click to expand...

That's probably the important reason. It also mirrors the old standard emergency brake lever that have been in cars forever.

DeaneG said:

My favorite backwards control is the e-brake flapper? Pull on it to engage - why not push like any other electronic control. Pulling a lever to activate something is so 1903.

Edit: figured it out - so the loose puppy in the front seat won't step on the e-brake control and launch the car into a tailslide.

Click to expand...

As with most electroinc standards (switches come to mind), up is on, down is off. Years of safety studies have shown it's usually more dangerous to accidentally turn something on than turn something off and it's easier to drop something or lean on a switch and have it go down instead of up. For example you wouldn't want a circuit breaker to turn on when you are repairing an outlet. Most things has been designed a particular way and standards adopted for a reason. (Ever wonder why the hot water is on the left? Most people are right handed and it protects you from accidentally scalding yourself.) We might not always know the reason but there usually is some logic behind it.

pasowino said:

Ok, this is probably a silly thing, but when I sat down in the Leaf for the first time and put it in "gear", it seemed counter-intuitive to have to push the joy stick forward to go backwards and backwards to go forward. I know it was set up like this to resemble an automatic transmission in an ICE car, but even with that, it still seemed like it was backwards to me.

Anyone else feel the same way?

Click to expand...

I can see that it depends on what one is familiar with. Almost every auto transmission I have seen goes P-R-N-D-1-2 or P-R-N-D-+/- front to back with the +/- maybe side-to-side. Some manual transmission has reverse over on the right behind the top gear.

I have zero issues with the LEAF's shift pattern. My VW has reverse to the left and forward, so moving the mouse shifter left-forward for R is perfect. As for backwards for D, a manual transmission's shifter goes both forward and back for forwards speeds, so I have no issue there either.