2 out of 2 quick-chargers down, 75-mile tow home.

So much for any environmental benefits for that recent trip :|. At 10 mpg and 150 miles for the tow truck, it'll take a month or two of driving the LEAF to "make up for it". The story:

I stopped at the first quick charger without checking plugshare, because in two years I had never had a problem with it. Turns out it has been down for six weeks or so.

Then I charged at one of the Level 2s for an hour so I could make it to the next DCQC (both well-reputed and working, according to plugshare). I arrive, find the charger, and am hopeful... only to find "Error" on the screen. Apparently, this because some 'vandal' had pushed the big red emergency button in the few hours since the last successful charge. Popping the button back out does nothing, and being after hours, the maintenance people who might have been able to reset it were not around.

So, being two or more hours behind schedule, I decide to "give up" and request a tow home.

First, I tried Nissan's Roadside Assistance, only to be told that there is a 50-mile limit to it. Fortunately, I have AAA+, which has 100 miles, so I ended up going with them (my second call). Had I not had plus, I would have had to combine the two services to minimize my return expenses! OR, spent several more hours (it was already 11:30 PM at this point) at a Level 2 in order to get home on electricity.

What's wrong with this picture? Several things, imho: 1.) The quick-chargers are WAY TOO unreliable for regular trips like this; 2.) there should be multiple plugs at each "station"; 3.) turnaround time on repairing broken ones is also WAY TOO long; and finally, 4.) there should be a simple way to reset chargers (or time-delayed automatic reset) when nothing is actually wrong with them beyond their emergency stop button having been pressed.

Whaddya think? Are things going to get better before these kind of stories become known and associated with Nissan, the LEAF, or Chademos? I'd hate for the latter to happen among the general population even though it's already happening to me a little. (And I'm a big "fan" of all three, but this is not the first time I've had this kind of a problem.)

Something similar happened to me this past week. One thing is that if we experience a charger not functioning that we have a membership in, we should get a credit for our troubles. Perhaps the non-member fee as effectively we have been deprived of our paid membership. I also feel that there should be some consequences to Nissan dealers who let their chargers fail for lack of upkeep and repairs ... like replacing cooling air filters. Out sourcing repairs also seem to be an emerging problem. Seems like some electricians have other matters to attend to while the charger sits for weeks waiting repair.

Agreed on all counts. A couple of weeks ago I had to make 5 stops to finally find a DCQC in Redwood City that was working. Better endind for me but what a lot of unnecessary stress.

What we need is a centralized system that would keep track all DCQC status in real time along with a reservation system. The service could determine which station is in range for your car, calculate your arrival time and book it for 30min. I'd pay for that.

Broken touch screen, emergency stop, vandalism. The fact that those break down so frequently is still a problem but if only we could know where to go and be assured that we'd be able to start recharging within a few minutes that would already go a long way.

mbender said:

Then I charged at one of the Level 2s for an hour so I could make it to the next DCQC (both well-reputed and working, according to plugshare). I arrive, find the charger, and am hopeful... only to find "Error" on the screen. Apparently, this because some 'vandal' had pushed the big red emergency button in the few hours since the last successful charge. Popping the button back out does nothing, and being after hours, the maintenance people who might have been able to reset it were not around.
...
What's wrong with this picture? Several things, imho: 1.) The quick-chargers are WAY TOO unreliable for regular trips like this; 2.) there should be multiple plugs at each "station"; 3.) turnaround time on repairing broken ones is also WAY TOO long; and finally, 4.) there should be a simple way to reset chargers (or time-delayed automatic reset) when nothing is actually wrong with them beyond their emergency stop button having been pressed.

Whaddya think? Are things going to get better before these kind of stories become known and associated with Nissan, the LEAF, or Chademos? I'd hate for the latter to happen among the general population even though it's already happening to me a little. (And I'm a big "fan" of all three, but this is not the first time I've had this kind of a problem.)

Click to expand...

With the emergency stop case, did you also power cycle the DC FC after getting the red button to pop out? I've found that was necessary for http://nissanqc.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. Got a Plugshare links to the ones you hit problems with?

Agreed on all your points.

As for things going to get better, hard to say. I've looked at the status of numerous DC FCs in the South Bay (some free, some not) and many are broken right now. And, two formerly free http://nissanqc.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; are apparently no longer free. So, I probably won't be using those anymore.

The units were in Vacaville and Davis (Campus), and I reported both problems on plugshare. I'm not sure what "cycling" means or how to do it. There was no external breaker (big red handle which powers the charger on/off) as there is on some other ones, otherwise I would have done that. If instructions come up on the screen when the button is popped back out, then I may not have "popped" it far enough because the screen did not change. (I just turned it left and right until it jumped out to what seemed like its ready position.)

As for formerly free dealer quick chargers becoming part of a membership network, I agree and agree that it unfortunate. Worse yet in my mind is that they seem to have signed up with EVGo.

mbender said:

The units were in Vacaville and Davis (Campus), and I reported both problems on plugshare. I'm not sure what "cycling" means or how to do it. There was no external breaker (big red handle which powers the charger on/off) as there is on some other ones, otherwise I would have done that. If instructions come up on the screen when the button is popped back out, then I may not have "popped" it far enough because the screen did not change. (I just turned it left and right until it jumped out to what seemed like its ready position.)

Click to expand...

Yes, I meant power cycling by turning off then back on a big breaker switch nearby, if applicable.

I don't recall if the screen changes if you get the red button to pop out, but that coupled w/a power cycle should've been enough.

mbender said:

As for formerly free dealer quick chargers becoming part of a membership network, I agree and agree that it unfortunate. Worse yet in my mind is that they seem to have signed up with EVGo.

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Yes, that's happened too, but I never charged at those dealers anyway. I'm talking about these formerly free DC FCs @ Walgreens.

http://api.plugshare.com/view/location/37780" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - when I visited last after it supposedly became part of the Blink Network, there was no visible card reader and there was an out of order sign taped to it

http://api.plugshare.com/view/location/6277" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Back to the dealers, yeah, they had the choices at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=15867" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. Some here have gone to eVgo and some have gone to Chargepoint. One that still free dealer one I use is w/Chargepoint. Their sister dealer in Fremont has gone to eVgo.

IMHO, now that the EV market is getting beyond its "infancy" (at least in some markets), this is one of the biggest problems we have - lack of RELIABLE access to WORKING Level 3 EVSEs. Elon's got the right idea - site 4-6 quick charging stations in a common area. It's how the gas stations have done it for years. Can you imagine if there was only one or two gas stations in a town, each with one pump that could easily be taken out of service, with no one around to reset it?

Just this past week, I had to do a 65-mile round trip for 3 successive evenings, and I was forced to take the gasser (because my LEAF's range is down to 60 miles). The one DCQC en route had been reported up and down a number of times in the past 3 weeks, and the nearby Level2 (this was at a Nissan dealer) had been out of order for more than a month.

As much as we need batteries with more range, we need reliable quick charging. Without it, EVs will be forever limited to "city cars" for all but the extremely adventurous few.

I too Just had a zero for 2 failed QC day... First one was the local Nissan dealership (come on, it has been listed on plugshare as needing a new air filter for the thermostat for a month or more!) Also, it isn't acceptable, imho, that the dealerships are not checking to make sure the CHAdeMOs are in working order every day... It should be part of their job to make sure that side of their customer base is taken care of just as well as if they had bought an ICE!
Anywho, the second failed QC in the same day was partly my fault since the last user of the brand new CHADeMO / Combo plug had listed it as throwing an error code and not allowing a charge. But, again, it has been at least a month since that first charge error, so I assumed that they would have fixed it by now! Thankfully, most L3s have an L2 right there which softens the blow to the QC charge fault.
I hope we, and the industry figure out a way to keep on top of this soon...

I check plugshare, but you cant depend on it. Multiple times I see the most recent review was negative, and the charger worked fine. The converse mudt also be true. I think most ev drivers dont use it.

mbender said:

The units were in Vacaville and Davis (Campus), and I reported both problems on plugshare...

Click to expand...

Sounds like you stopped at the two free DC charge sites at Davis and Vacaville, and neither was functional.

And you did not try to charge at either of the two pay-for-charge DC sites at Davis and Vacaville, both of which plugshare has reported as functional, calling for a tow instead?

The moral of this story may be that DC charge sites will never be reliable until they are profitable.

If you really want reliable DC, you can show support by paying for it.

="mbender"
...As for formerly free dealer quick chargers becoming part of a membership network, I agree and agree that it unfortunate. Worse yet in my mind is that they seem to have signed up with EVGo...

Click to expand...

I have no love for for EVGo, or the rotten legal settlement that puts NO DC chargers up in North California, a region which was hit just as hard by the Enron-led criminal conspiracy, as was Central California.

But before I left on my ~600 mile bay area trip ~two weeks ago, I bought an EVGo card, and would have used it if I had to.

I would buy Electricity from Exxon before calling for a flatbed.

I hope Nissan is reading this thread and others like it (many, including a new one just created today) as though they were in the Suggestions to Nissan sub-forum. Because this is quickly headed toward critical mass and may end up exploding "all over the place", and tarnishing their good name and intentions.

Last spring Nissan donated 2 QC stations to the state of Utah and they worked a deal with Salt Lake City to install them downtown on 500 south. Great location and it all looked really good at first. Then 2 weeks later the problems started with the stations.

That was in June and the 2 stations have been offline since then. Multiple calls to the city and to Nissan have gone nowhere fast.
These stations where built by ABB. You would think a large company like that could build something more reliable.

These are the error messages that appear on the machines. Is this a common thing for ABB quick charge stations ?

2nd error message

This is a picture of the ABB quick charge station in SLC that no one is willing to repair.

Does Nissan do repair on these stations or does ABB do the repair ?

Does anyone have a name and phone number of someone that can do QC repair ?

edatoakrun said:

And you did not try to charge at either of the two pay-for-charge DC sites at Davis and Vacaville, both of which plugshare has reported as functional, calling for a tow instead?

Click to expand...

I did not know about the new Vacaville pay site (didn't show on plugshare at the time), and was not about to try my luck, use more time and possibly strike out at a third station. This is also why I hesitated to specify the locations; that they are/were the free ones is largely besides the point(s).

edatoakrun said:

The moral of this story may be that DC charge sites will never be reliable until they are profitable.

Click to expand...

I'm not sure there is a good business case for these networks or that they will ever be profitable. I do, however, think there is a great national-interest case for them. And though I haven't done the math (yet), it might behoove, if not benefit, the federal and state governments to eventually subsidize fast-charging stations, and maybe even the electricity provided as well. A billion $ per day (or whatever) sent out of the local/domestic economies adds up and does damage pretty quickly.

Perhaps after the 200,000 limit is reached for several "non-compliance-car-only" manufacturers, they could think of transitioning the benefit from the vehicles to the fuel. I dunno, perhaps there is already a thread on this idea/topic?

edatoakrun said:

I would buy Electricity from Exxon before calling for a flatbed.

Click to expand...

For the most part, this is true for me as well. But at midnight, after hours of frustration, with responsibilities at home, and frozen goods thawing in the back seat, exceptions are made.

KJD said:

This is a picture of the ABB quick charge station in SLC that no one is willing to repair.

Does Nissan do repair on these stations or does ABB do the repair ?

Does anyone have a name and phone number of someone that can do QC repair ?

Click to expand...

Find the circuit breaker - perhaps inside the building, turn it off wait a few secs then turn it back on. Go to the charger an press the reset button. It will recycle the computer inside. I did this recently at a Cracker Barrel when the manager told me he had no clue and the help number he had wasn't being answered. I showed him my Blink card and told him "ill fix it" guess he thought i was Official. .

KJD said:

This is a picture of the ABB quick charge station in SLC that no one is willing to repair.

Does Nissan do repair on these stations or does ABB do the repair ?

Does anyone have a name and phone number of someone that can do QC repair ?

Click to expand...

Not sure how much Nissan would care. It's not http://nissanqc.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;, so I'm surprised they donated an ABB unit.

Even for us in the Bay Area, apparently the two Walgreens http://nissanqc.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; that I posted were installed and serviced by Aerovironment (well, at least prior to the Blink equipment being installed). Some guy in the area did a lot of sleuthing to figure that out and get a copy of the Aerovironment's filter cleaning guide. You wouldn't know I don't recall any labels even referring to Aerovironment. At least one of them had the contact info for the electrical contractor that installed the big breaker box (and not sure what else), but it was some local company, not AV.

I'd try contacting Nissan, ABB and the electrical contractor, if there's any name/contact info there.

cwerdna said:

I'd try contacting Nissan, ABB and the electrical contractor, if there's any name/contact info there.

Click to expand...

Last Friday I called the Nissan 800 number and asked "Who can repair these units?"
After an hour on the phone the answer was gosh we do not know. I will have someone get back to you on that.

Silly me I thought Nissan wanted to sell more LEAFs by providing chargers that worked.

There is no contact information anywhere on the machine.

^^^
Man. That sucks! What a waste of time! Gotta love how the left hand doesn't seem to know what the right hand is doing. Maybe the UT state govt knows who installed them?

For some of the dealer DC FCs (http://nissanqc.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false, there was some Aerovironment info on some of them. However, once they became networked (http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=15867" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false, I believe Chargepoint or eVGo then assumed duties of repairs/maintenance.

How about contacting ABB via http://new.abb.com/us/about/contact-center" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;?

Someday tow trucks will carry a quick charger.
http://realacpower.com/mobile-ev-quick-charge/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

DanCar said:

Someday tow trucks will carry a quick charger.
http://realacpower.com/mobile-ev-quick-charge/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Yes. And even though this is "my" topic, just earlier today I posted the following (about AAA announcing it) on a related thread:

Ostensibly, AAA introduced quick-charging trucks to some of their fleets in 2011. I used one at Plugin Day or similar get-together in 2013, but in a recent call to AAA near Sacramento, they basically didn't know what I was talking (asking) about. I'm curious if anyone here has ever used one in a "true" roadside assistance setting.

AAA Introduces Emergency Roadside Charging for Electric Cars (plugincars.com, August 2011)
Level 3 Roadside Charging from AAA (showtimesdaily.com, October 2011)

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