Capacity Loss on 2011-2012 LEAFs

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TomT said:
Yep, I planned to and actually had the turn-in date set. Two days before, I dropped the fourth bar as I backed out of the driveway at 59,983 miles... So, I thought about it a bit, and had it towed to Nissan who confirmed with corporate that I was indeed entitled to a new battery (I had opted back in earlier). I then called Nissan Finance who said I could cancel the turn-in if I wanted to and extent the lease on a month by month basis. At that point I negotiated the two months lease credit and a third month by grinding them a little since my car would be out of service for a while while the new battery was ordered and installed (they also gave me a loaner Altima)... So, I told them OK and here we are. It gives me a brand new Lizard battery, three months free, and some time to see what cars the future brings...

I am still amazed that I dropped the fourth bar just before the warranty ended at 60K as I was not expecting that based on the numbers! Geez, 17 miles short!

dgpcolorado said:
I thought you were going to get rid of your LEAF at lease end. Chose otherwise?

I added the 4th bar lost to the wiki but you don't have a 3 bar loss report in there. Got any idea on the date / miles on that?
 
Ironically, as it turns out, it appears that beating the hell out of the battery would have been the best course for most of us!

Stoaty said:
Unfortunately, not true. Four year anniversary coming up in 2 weeks, 40,000 miles, capacity - 51.31 Ah. I figure I won't drop the 4th bar for about 2 years, perhaps a bit longer. No Lizard for me, unless I decide to purchase.
 
I live about 10 miles from TomT. The west side is a lot cooler than the inland valleys. Your car gets that advantage at night even if it is in the valley during the day.

Stoaty said:
91040 said:
Interesting. We both have the same climate. So my higher mileage and/or QCs got me to the same capacity 5 months sooner. Doesn't seem like any of these batteries will last 5 years with 9 capacity bars in our climate.
Unfortunately, not true. Four year anniversary coming up in 2 weeks, 40,000 miles, capacity - 51.31 Ah. I figure I won't drop the 4th bar for about 2 years, perhaps a bit longer. No Lizard for me, unless I decide to purchase.
 
TomT said:
Ironically, as it turns out, it appears that beating the hell out of the battery would have been the best course for most of us!
How true :!:
A big part of Stoaty's slower capacity bar loss is extremely efficient driving.

I don't have that issue, but the first three years I did protect capacity by 80% charging just in time and left garage doors partially open to avoid LEAF being in garge temperature 15F above ambient.
If I had not done that, I might have gotten a $6,000 replacement battery too :shock:

Instead I likely will lose the fourth bar at five years and six months, at around 34,000 miles.
Unless we get a summer like 2011 with multiple 104F days and do lots of driving and DCQC on those days.
 
Yep, my car lived in a hot garage most nights in the summer...

91040 said:
I live about 10 miles from TomT. The west side is a lot cooler than the inland valleys. Your car gets that advantage at night even if it is in the valley during the day.
 
TomT said:
Yep, my car lived in a hot garage most nights in the summer...

Here in Florida, my garage too was very hot all night. I used to park the LEAF outside, and run the 110v charger cord under the door to the car. But I wasn't happy with that as it is so inefficient to charge on 110v.

One thing that helped, although obviously only slightly, was getting a hybrid water heater. As essentially an air conditioner to heat water, it does cool things off some.

I have seen a person who put Styrofoam in the garage door panels, and that really helped. I just haven't gotten around to doing that.
 
I have a tankless water heater and my garage door has Styrofoam insulation in it from the factory... But the roof above it is open and uninsulated so a good bit of heat comes from that...

sub3marathonman said:
One thing that helped, although obviously only slightly, was getting a hybrid water heater. As essentially an air conditioner to heat water, it does cool things off some.
I have seen a person who put Styrofoam in the garage door panels, and that really helped. I just haven't gotten around to doing that.
 
TomT said:
I have a tankless water heater and my garage door has Styrofoam insulation in it from the factory... But the roof above it is open and uninsulated so a good bit of heat comes from that...

There's that "weakest link" problem rearing its ugly head!!
 
dhanson865 said:
I updated the wiki to add a Model Year column so we can mark the 2013 and newer as they come in. I need help finding entries that haven't been added yet and adding model years if you already have an entry.

The 1st bar losers from 2013 are rolling in. I expect these threads to be very active this summer.

Not sure if both threads should stay separate, one get locked, or both be merged...
 
dhanson865 said:
...
Not sure if both threads should stay separate, one get locked, or both be merged...
Don't lock it.
Still lots of information to be added on 2011 capacity losses.
Have only seen one report on five capacity bar loss.
That got new battery under capacity warranty, along with warranty motor replacement.
When capacity warranty runs out, should start seeing info on six, seven, maybe even eight capacity bar losses.
 
TimLee said:
...Still lots of information to be added on 2011 capacity losses...That got new battery under capacity warranty, along with warranty motor replacement.
I am one who appreciates the reports and data entered here. The Arizona and Texas losses were an early alert, but the nearby Los Angeles posts have been particularly valuable when gauging our situation. Our Leaf's capacity just dropped below 44Ahrs yesterday, making a summer warranty battery replacement almost certain. We'll certainly be glad to get the capacity back and be able to run the A/C in the upcoming warmer weather.
 
please forgive the crospost but I've done some heavy updates on the wiki and it'd be good for some to review the updates

dhanson865 said:
uggh, just realized http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=17168" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; had tons of 4 bar losers that didn't make the wiki. Spent an hour or so reding 50 pages of posts and editing the wiki. Still not done but have added or edited:

#24 June 21, 2014 Pipcecil AKA Nathan Drozd
#23 Feb 2015 JupiterLEAF
#22 Jan 6, 2015 leafer77
#21 December 2014 evblues
#20 August 2014 JPVLeaf

still need to do some backfill of 3 bar and 2 bar losses for some of those 4 bar losers above.

I still can't believe they shafted leafer77 like that, I was hoping he would get someone higher up at Nissan to overturn the lower/mid level decision to deny his claim outright.

At the least I would expect them to sell him a 2015 style pack at half cost (like $3000), even better a free 2015 style pack, and best they would buy his car back at lease residual style calcs (slightly above current used car values) and let him decide what to apply that money on (another used Leaf, a Kia Soul EV, a 2016 Leaf with the 30 kWh battery, a Tesla?)
 
My turn:

Lost the first capacity bar today, 6-3-15, at 3 years, 5½ months.

Model Year: 2012 SV
Manufactured: October 2011
Purchased: December 2012
Mileage: 26,939 miles
Amp•hours: 55.73
Hx: 70.71

No DCFC port, so no QCs. Average mileage measured from the wall: 3.98 miles/kWh

I might well end up pretty close to Nissan's original capacity estimate of 80% at five years; perhaps a bit below that. No free replacement battery for me, of course.
 
So sorry dgp, that first one is always tough. I remember on my first Leaf, a 2011, I would cringe when I started the car and look at the capacity bars. Of course I did not think I would lose the first one at 6,771 miles.
 
dhanson865 said:
please forgive the crospost but I've done some heavy updates on the wiki and it'd be good for some to review the updates

dhanson865 said:
uggh, just realized http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=17168" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; had tons of 4 bar losers that didn't make the wiki. Spent an hour or so reding 50 pages of posts and editing the wiki. Still not done but have added or edited:

#24 June 21, 2014 Pipcecil AKA Nathan Drozd
#23 Feb 2015 JupiterLEAF
#22 Jan 6, 2015 leafer77
#21 December 2014 evblues
#20 August 2014 JPVLeaf

still need to do some backfill of 3 bar and 2 bar losses for some of those 4 bar losers above.

I still can't believe they shafted leafer77 like that, I was hoping he would get someone higher up at Nissan to overturn the lower/mid level decision to deny his claim outright.

At the least I would expect them to sell him a 2015 style pack at half cost (like $3000), even better a free 2015 style pack, and best they would buy his car back at lease residual style calcs (slightly above current used car values) and let him decide what to apply that money on (another used Leaf, a Kia Soul EV, a 2016 Leaf with the 30 kWh battery, a Tesla?)

fwiw I added a couple more the other day

#26 May 29, 2015 memoryisram
#25 May 1st, 2015 PatricioEV

culled from http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=14102&start=420" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
 
dgpcolorado said:
My turn:
Lost the first capacity bar today, 6-3-15, at 3 years, 5½ months.

Huh. We were tracking pretty close until the last few months, I believe (just going off your sig). LeafDD has shown my aHr as low as 56.4 this Spring, but as of now it's back up to 57.1. I may not lose a bar until next year now.
 
ampitupco said:
Huh. We were tracking pretty close until the last few months, I believe (just going off your sig). LeafDD has shown my aHr as low as 56.4 this Spring, but as of now it's back up to 57.1. I may not lose a bar until next year now.
I am surprised that I am so much ahead of you in capacity loss since you live in a much hotter area. My hypothesis is that since all my driving involves steep climbs and descents, and the associated battery heating that entails, I get more degradation than one gets driving on relatively level terrain.

My Ahr had dropped several tenths in the last week. But the tipping point may have been a 108 mile trip to Black Canyon NP the previous day: More than 5000 feet of cumulative elevation change plus 2½ hours of charging enroute, in 82ºF weather. When I noticed that my bar had dropped yesterday the car had charged for several hours in the sun and the battery temp was 27ºC. That's pretty warm for spring.

Have you had the P3227 update done?

DesertDenizen said:
So sorry dgp, that first one is always tough. I remember on my first Leaf, a 2011, I would cringe when I started the car and look at the capacity bars. Of course I did not think I would lose the first one at 6,771 miles.
Yeah, I'd have been dismayed to lose a CB at that mileage. But I've had LeafDD for a long time now and I knew a year ago that I would drop the bar this spring or summer, so it was more a matter of interest than concern.

We got our first L2 public charge stations in this area a year ago so my declining range hasn't been a problem. I just plug-in while shopping or watching a movie and have enough charge to get home when I am done, even in winter. Prior to the public charge stations I was becoming concerned about being able to do my 60-70 mile grocery shopping trips in winter. Now it isn't an issue. So, still quite happy with my LEAF.
 
P3227 update?

I bought a used Leaf, would I be able to call and get that info or do I have to show up at a dealer to let them check the car?

I've tried looking on the Nissan website but there doesn't seem to be a way to get info on the car other than what carwings does.

I'm only down 1 bar so I'm not terribly worried about capacity but it'd be good to know what I have.
 
dgpcolorado said:
I am surprised that I am so much ahead of you in capacity loss since you live in a much hotter area. My hypothesis is that since all my driving involves steep climbs and descents, and the associated battery heating that entails, I get more degradation than one gets driving on relatively level terrain.

Have you had the P3227 update done?

Yes, I had it done (Sept 2013?). I blame it for most of my regen loss.
 
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