What Nissan Leaf has the improved battery?

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Which years of the Nissan Leaf have the improved battery that is less sensitive to higher temperatures? I have read it was the 2014 and later model years.

Also, if you buy a used Nissan Leaf can you still get the battery replaced for $5,500 plus tax and installation fees from a Nissan Dealer?
 
So the 2015 and later models have the improved battery chemistry. It looks like I will only want to buy the used 2013 and later models eventually because there will be no extra cost on battery installation. The 2012 and 2011 models of the Leaf need adjustments made for the new battery technology.
 
Well, I guess that is true if you plan on paying for a new battery. The only difference is a few extra adapter cables, which probably don't amount to much money. But, depending where you live, a 2011 or 2012 might be a better bargain if the battery degrades fast enough to warrant a free battery replacement. There were a few small tweaks to the battery chemistry in 2013, and depending where you live that could make the difference between qualifying for a new battery by 60,000 miles/60 months, or having to live with a degraded battery until you can afford to pay the $6000 out of your own pocket. In my opinion, I'm a little concerned that those chemistry tweaks really will do nothing in the long run except cheat more people out of a free 2015 battery replacement, as it may just slow the degradation slightly enough to get past the warranty period.
As I said though, it all depends where you live, how far your commute is, and how many miles you plan on putting on the Leaf per year. I'm in south Florida, and I wouldn't even consider a 2013 or 2014 because of my fear that it won't degrade fast enough to get the better chemistry replacement. There have been several posts on here recently of guys who have found cheap 2011 or 2012 Leafs that have lost 4 bars, or were close to it, thereby qualifying them for a new battery, which they got replaced free.
If you live in a cooler climate, and don't mind driving the Leaf until the battery degrades to the point you can't use it anymore, and you have budgeted in coughing up the $6000 for a new battery, go for it.
 
I'm leasing my 2013, and I appreciate still having 12 apparent bars after 2+ years. The only way I'll buy the car is if I win or inherit a decent sum of money, so from my perspective the tweak is a good thing, no question. By extending the lease I should be able to replace this car with a 125 mile range SV in a year or two.
 
11/12 Leafs were made in Japan and there's some anecdotal evidence of higher build quality. They are also said to have slightly better acceleration/dynamics, but I have no first hand experience with newer models.
 
LeftieBiker said:
I'm leasing my 2013, and I appreciate still having 12 apparent bars after 2+ years.

My leased '13 SV (build month of 6/2013) hits the 2 year end of lease mark on 7/27/15. It still has 12 capacity bars after a bit over ~23.2K miles. I'm in the South Bay portion of the SF Bay Area which gets MUCH hotter than say SF, but not as bad in the summer as say Walnut Creek.

At last check, Ahr=58.66 SOH=89% Hx=89.08%. I have no idea of its reading when new or max gids when new.

The lease return '13 SV I bought (build month of 5/2013), looks like in service date of near end of 6/2013 also still has all capacity bars after almost 23.9K miles. It was a Bay Area car, possibly based originally in/around Saratoga. Carfax shows service records at Premier Nissan of Stevens Creek in Santa Clara. Last check showed Ahr=60.15 SOH=91% Hx=92.212%. I suspect the previous driver wasn't a Leaf enthusiast or MNL regular as it doesn't feel like it had NTB14-017 (grabby brake TSB) done, judging by its braking behavior.

A previous '13 Leaf SV lease return also almost certainly didn't have it applied. It also had all its capacity bars and I recall it's Hx and SOH readings were similar to my near end of lease car.
 
My wife and I each have a 2013 Leaf, Both May 13 build dates. We both have about 21k miles on our cars. Both have about the same LeafSpy numbers as new, but those numbers are not very good at telling true degradation. Yesterday I drove my car 95 miles (moderately efficient driving 4.6 mi/kwh, drove 59-60mph) and had a bit left when I arrived home (estimated 3 mi to turtle). Palo Alto to Lafayette and back. This is nearly identical to the mileage I got when the car was new. I live in Palo Alto, a little cooler than San Jose, a little warmer than San Francisco.

Unfortunately, especially for the 2013 Leafs, the LeafSpy numbers are not comparable from car to car. Nissan apparently made some programming tweaks to SOME of the 2013 models. The only sure way to judge if your battery had degraded is to do a range test.

It is unclear exactly what was done to the battery in the 2013 Leafs, but it is clearly much more tolerant of heat than the batteries in the 2011 and 2012s.
 
In 2013 the LEAF battery was completely redesigned, mainly for manufacturability, cost reductions and reliability. It has remained a 24kWh battery.

A simple way to identify a Mk1 battery vs. a Mk2 battery is that the external case is black on the newer battery vs. grey on the first generation battery. Along with the battery changes, there were significant software revisions to the BCM, and other SW battery management systems. Since 2013 there have been numerous rolling production changes to both the physical battery and its electronics as well as the SW. Many of these changes were to improve the reliability and durability of the battery.
 
OrientExpress said:
In 2013 the LEAF battery was completely redesigned, mainly for manufacturability, cost reductions and reliability. It has remained a 24kWh battery. ...
Do you know what was changed for 2015 battery?
 
Specifically, no, but there have been a significant number of rolling changes to the battery since 2013. The most notable is its performance in high heat and multiple charging events over a short time. The 2014 and 2015 batteries are much more tolerant to these types of events.
 
Valdemar said:
11/12 Leafs were made in Japan and there's some anecdotal evidence of higher build quality. They are also said to have slightly better acceleration/dynamics, but I have no first hand experience with newer models.

It's a little better than anecdotal. Michael Karesh of Truedelta has quite a lot of data supporting the assertion that 2011/12 LEAF's have very very few unscheduled visits to the repair shop compared to 2013 onward.
 
Nissan has never expounded on what was changed other than "new chemistry..." The consensus of opinion was that it had largely to do with the anodes... Nissan was extreme cycle testing the new battery way back when we had our meeting in Phoenix on August 23 of 2013 to validate the new changes... At the time, they said they expected it to go in to production cars in "the latter part of 2014" if it passed...

DanCar said:
Do you know what was changed for 2015 battery?
 
keydiver said:
Well, I guess that is true if you plan on paying for a new battery. The only difference is a few extra adapter cables, which probably don't amount to much money. But, depending where you live, a 2011 or 2012 might be a better bargain if the battery degrades fast enough to warrant a free battery replacement. There were a few small tweaks to the battery chemistry in 2013, and depending where you live that could make the difference between qualifying for a new battery by 60,000 miles/60 months, or having to live with a degraded battery until you can afford to pay the $6000 out of your own pocket. In my opinion, I'm a little concerned that those chemistry tweaks really will do nothing in the long run except cheat more people out of a free 2015 battery replacement, as it may just slow the degradation slightly enough to get past the warranty period.
As I said though, it all depends where you live, how far your commute is, and how many miles you plan on putting on the Leaf per year. I'm in south Florida, and I wouldn't even consider a 2013 or 2014 because of my fear that it won't degrade fast enough to get the better chemistry replacement. There have been several posts on here recently of guys who have found cheap 2011 or 2012 Leafs that have lost 4 bars, or were close to it, thereby qualifying them for a new battery, which they got replaced free.
If you live in a cooler climate, and don't mind driving the Leaf until the battery degrades to the point you can't use it anymore, and you have budgeted in coughing up the $6000 for a new battery, go for it.

Is this true? I live in SoCal and there are a few 2011's for as low as $7,500. With a new battery that sounds like a pretty good deal. Any links to the people that have done this?
 
DiamondDan73 said:
keydiver said:
Well, I guess that is true if you plan on paying for a new battery. The only difference is a few extra adapter cables, which probably don't amount to much money. But, depending where you live, a 2011 or 2012 might be a better bargain if the battery degrades fast enough to warrant a free battery replacement. There were a few small tweaks to the battery chemistry in 2013, and depending where you live that could make the difference between qualifying for a new battery by 60,000 miles/60 months, or having to live with a degraded battery until you can afford to pay the $6000 out of your own pocket. In my opinion, I'm a little concerned that those chemistry tweaks really will do nothing in the long run except cheat more people out of a free 2015 battery replacement, as it may just slow the degradation slightly enough to get past the warranty period.
As I said though, it all depends where you live, how far your commute is, and how many miles you plan on putting on the Leaf per year. I'm in south Florida, and I wouldn't even consider a 2013 or 2014 because of my fear that it won't degrade fast enough to get the better chemistry replacement. There have been several posts on here recently of guys who have found cheap 2011 or 2012 Leafs that have lost 4 bars, or were close to it, thereby qualifying them for a new battery, which they got replaced free.
If you live in a cooler climate, and don't mind driving the Leaf until the battery degrades to the point you can't use it anymore, and you have budgeted in coughing up the $6000 for a new battery, go for it.

Is this true? I live in SoCal and there are a few 2011's for as low as $7,500. With a new battery that sounds like a pretty good deal. Any links to the people that have done this?

I've seen several posts like that. Check in one of these threads

Early Capacity Losses-Was(Lost a bar...down to 11) (the biggest monster thread) viewtopic.php?f=30&t=8802
The Battery Replacement Thread viewtopic.php?f=30&t=14102
POST YOUR BATTERY DEGRADATION RESULTS viewtopic.php?f=31&t=13371
2013 Low Battery Capacity AHr Battery Degradationviewtopic.php?f=31&t=13776
Early Adopter Mistake - Running on Empty viewtopic.php?f=27&t=19880
2013-2014 bar losers and capacity losses viewtopic.php?f=30&t=18269


sorry, too many posts for me to remember where I saw it.
 
So, I found a few 2012 SL's with 9 battery bars in my area with less than 40K miles under 9K. I can buy one and as soon as the next bar drops, I will get a new lizard battery? Sounds to good to be true...
 
DiamondDan73 said:
So, I found a few 2012 SL's with 9 battery bars in my area with less than 40K miles under 9K. I can buy one and as soon as the next bar drops, I will get a new lizard battery? Sounds to good to be true...

9,674 2011 leafs sold in the US
9,819 2012 leafs sold in the US

There are a few dozen that aren't eligible because the first owner opted out of the settlement

There might be a couple that have accident damage or got a paint job without taking the battery out that would invalidate the warranty.

Odds are 99% of them are eligible but considering the value difference I'd get the warranty status from the nearest Nissan dealer during your test drive.

Ideally your nearest Nissan dealer is within range of the used car dealer and you can drive over, plug it into the Chademo or L2 charger, walk to the service department and give them the VIN and ask for the warranty status and maintenance history while there.

The dealer might punt and have you call the 800 number for Leaf support in which case you walk back to the charger and ask the same questions from the comfort of the charging car while testing the climate control.

Bring along a phone and a ODBII wifi/bluetooth adapter and do your research on SOH%/ahr status while you have the car in hand.

I bought mine for $8995 without checking the warranty status because it was a 2012 with ~38,000 miles and 83% SOH so I don't expect to drop 4 bars in time and at the time you couldn't find a leaf cheaper than that. I didn't have the luxury to wait for a 3 or 4 bar loser that looked ready to give out a free battery.
 
Make sure that you get the information in writing, either as part of the sales contract with the dealer, or from Nissan. Salespeople will say *anything* to make a sale, true or not.
 
DiamondDan73 said:
So, I found a few 2012 SL's with 9 battery bars in my area with less than 40K miles under 9K. I can buy one and as soon as the next bar drops, I will get a new lizard battery? Sounds to good to be true...
Prehaps not too good to be true. I remember also seeing in another thread that there's been at least 1 2013 3 bar loser in AZ. I see it at http://www.electricvehiclewiki.com/Real_World_Battery_Capacity_Loss#Loss_of_three_battery_capacity_bars_.2827.5.25.29.

Man... that would be nice, but likely hard to find in the SF Bay Area. If I could buy a '13 Leaf w/the stuff I want (SV w/premium package only) 3 bar loser that was well under 60K miles and tolerate that loss, I'd have all the improvements/features of the '13 and new lizard battery probably within a year.

Unfortunately, it seems like the auction Leafs in the Bay Area tend to be Bay Area vehicles. It doesn't make sense for Nissan to ship in lease returns from Phoenix or other hot climates. There already seems to be plenty of supply from Bay area lease returns.

Maybe people should go hunting for lease returns in Phoenix or Texas and get them shipped over.
 
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