2015 S/SV/SL vs. 2011 SL ?

I'm looking at a 2011 Leaf SL with only 21k miles, 82% SOH and 92% capacity remaining for about $13,000. This car has, literally, every option that was available at that time. It's loaded.

However, many have pointed out that I could receive $10,000 in federal+state tax credits if I were to buy a new, 2015 Leaf. In that case, I'm considering the base model with very few (or zero) options to get the initial price down as low as possible. However, this might be short-sighted.

My primary use would be a daily 36-mile round-trip commute plus weekend errands--probably less than 10,000 miles/year. Summers here are hot, but the rest of the year is mild, with cool-ish winters.

Does anyone have any compelling reason to spend the extra money for the SV? The SL? Alternatively, are there any must-have options if I went with the S version?

Thanks!

The only reason I'd buy a 2015 S is for the Lizard pack. Otherwise I'd personally stretch my budget to the SL.

Given between a 2014 (non-lizard) S and a 2011 SL, if the degradation wasn't an issue for me, I'd probably go with the 2011 SL - there are features ONLY on the 2011 (though some of them also appear on the 2012) I've grown to love and would miss.

The only issue would be that the 2011 would be out of factory bumper-to-bumper warranty (though still under drivetrain, battery capacity*, and battery workmanship and materials), unless it had an extended warranty or dealer warranty.

*You need to make sure it isn't flagged with B0133.

mwalsh said:

[edited]

The only issue would be that the 2011 would be out of factory bumper-to-bumper warranty (though still under drivetrain, battery capacity*, and battery workmanship and materials), unless it had an extended warranty or dealer warranty.

*You need to make sure it isn't flagged with B0133.

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Actually, this is a Nissan Certified Pre-owned, so it has the 100,000 mile / 7-year warranty included.

I've heard of the B0133 issue, but I don't know exactly how I determine if this applies. I have the Leaf Spy Pro data--where should I look for this?

Thanks!

Martin

I would go with the 2015 base model, just to get the extra range. You might not need it for your daily commute, but you never know when your job or your commute might change. Most people actually use the LEAF as their main car because it is more fun to drive than a gas guzzler, so the range becomes more of an issue at that time.

You would also get a new 5 year battery warranty instead of one nearing the end of its 5 year warranty period.

The only option you might look at adding is the charge package so that you can quick charge. Take a look at plugshare.com and see if there are any CHAdeMO charge stations in your area.

They have improved the LEAF S in 2015 in that they added cruise control. Prior to this I would not consider it at all, I do not want a car without cruise control.

The one option you definitely will want is the charge package. Gets you the much faster 6.0 kW into the battery on board charger which makes a big difference. And it gets you DCQC which I have used a lot.

What you cannot get is the much more efficient heat pump heater.
But with your 36 mile round trip with charging at work that may be OK for you.
My range in cold weather and with one capacity bar gone can be only 35 miles but I like the car warm.

For me buying a new LEAF I would want the SL with all options.
Not having Bose stereo is still one of the irritating things about my LEAF compared to my 2009 Altima. People also love the around view monitor.

You should consider leasing though.
If the Gen 2 LEAF has much longer range used values of the LEAF will plunge further than they already have.
If Nissan continues to do what they are doing on the 2012 leases with $5,000 off the residual, buying the 2015 S at end of lease could save you $ over buying now.
Or at that point you might elect to upgrade to Gen 2.

No guarantees though.
Nissan did NOT adjust residuals for 2011 leases so the 2011 leasors had to move on to another vehicle.

MartinChico said:

...
I've heard of the B0133 issue, but I don't know exactly how I determine if this applies ...

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The dealer has to look at the Nissan maintenance records for the VIN # of the vehicle. It is on the Service - Comm report if it is flagged.
It would be surprising they would sell one that was flagged as certified pre-owned.
But you never know.
I think certified pre-owned is something Nissan allows the dealer to offer, so the dealer might have missed it.

If you want to know all about B0133 here is the link to the 31 page thread:
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=17045&hilit=+B0133#p371761" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
But you might not want to read it.
Knowing about this kind of behaviour might make you run away screaming from considering any Nissan vehicle :shock: :shock:

TimLee said:

The one option you definitely will want is the charge package. Gets you the much faster 6.0 kW into the battery on board charger which makes a big difference. And it gets you the LED headlights which are great and DCQC which I have used a lot.

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The charge package does not include LED headlights on the S trim.

If you can stretch your budget to get a 2015 Leaf S with tax incentives/rebates, I'd go for that over a used 2011 Leaf SL. The older car will have likely used up the bumper to bumper warranty (3 years/36k miles) by now unless it was a unsold leftover, and even then it won't have much time left under that warranty. So anything that goes wrong not related to the battery or motor, such as with the nav system or the HVAC system, you'll be paying for.

Plus you'll get the battery improvements as well, and you won't miss the sucky nav system. You won't get a start timer (only end) and it will have the more power-hungry heater, but with a 36 mile commute you won't have a problem in winter. You won't get CarWings either, but that's scheduled to end for all of us at the end of 2016 when AT&T shuts down 2G service; no fix has yet been announced by Nissan for when this happens. As mentioned, cruise control is now standard across all trims, as is a regular backup camera starting in 2014.

QC package is a tossup. There's one in Chico, the next ones in any direction are in the area of I-80 and Highway 65, right at the Leaf's rated EPA range of 84 miles. Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be even an L2 option along the way (unless you swing over to I-5). If stretching your budget another $1800 or so isn't possible, you could probably opt out if you don't plan to move out of Chico.

Nissan and the local dealer have made the 2015 a much more attractive purchase (relative to the used 2011 model), so we bought the 2015 Leaf S w/Charge Package on Dec. 22, 2014. Here are the numbers that made this such a no-brainer:

TOTAL MSRP was $32,230, which included the following:
QC/6.4kW Charge Package: $1,770
Splash Guards (4-piece set): $190
Carpeted Cargo and Floor Mats: $180
Holographic Kick Plates (2-piece set): $130
Emergency Road and FIrst Aid Kit: $75
Cargo Net: $25
Destination and Handling $850

I really didn't want these exact accessories, but I could live with it.

Dealer discount: -$3,200.

Nissan rebate: -$3,500.

After these two deductions, the effective price was $25,530 (before any tax considerations).

After the federal tax credit of $7,500 plus a similar $2,500 from California, I have essentially bought the car for $15,530.

On top of all this, Nissan offered 0% financing for 72 months, so I took full advantage of this by only putting $3,000 down.

(Note that none of these numbers include sales tax, DMV fees, etc., which is substantial in California.)

bestbuyguy21 said:

The charge package does not include LED headlights on the S trim.

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Thanks for the correction.
I edited the post.

MartinChico said:

Nissan and the local dealer have made the 2015 a much more attractive purchase (relative to the used 2011 model), so we bought the 2015 Leaf S w/Charge Package on Dec. 22, 2014.

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Congratulations
I think a 2011 would have needed to be under $10K to compete.
They are beginning to get there at auction, but not at retail.

Did you consider leasing?
But with the six year financing purchase probably did have lower monthly payment, and no uncertainties of what might happen at end of the lease.

MartinChico said:

Nissan and the local dealer have made the 2015 a much more attractive purchase (relative to the used 2011 model), so we bought the 2015 Leaf S w/Charge Package on Dec. 22, 2014. Here are the numbers that made this such a no-brainer:

TOTAL MSRP was $32,230, which included the following:
QC/6.4kW Charge Package: $1,770
Splash Guards (4-piece set): $190
Carpeted Cargo and Floor Mats: $180
Holographic Kick Plates (2-piece set): $130
Emergency Road and FIrst Aid Kit: $75
Cargo Net: $25
Destination and Handling $850

I really didn't want these exact accessories, but I could live with it.

Dealer discount: -$3,200.

Nissan rebate: -$3,500.

After these two deductions, the effective price was $25,530 (before any tax considerations).

After the federal tax credit of $7,500 plus a similar $2,500 from California, I have essentially bought the car for $15,530.

On top of all this, Nissan offered 0% financing for 72 months, so I took full advantage of this by only putting $3,000 down.

(Note that none of these numbers include sales tax, DMV fees, etc., which is substantial in California.)

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Wow, that sounds like a great deal! And here I thought I was doing well getting my 2011 SL for "only" $23,000 after rebates, just 3 1/4 years ago. Of course you're paying sales tax as if the car cost $25,530, so that's an extra $1000 in effective price, but it doesn't matter. You can't get anything but a low-end gasser for $16K these days. Welcome to the club!

TimLee said:

MartinChico said:

Nissan and the local dealer have made the 2015 a much more attractive purchase (relative to the used 2011 model), so we bought the 2015 Leaf S w/Charge Package on Dec. 22, 2014.

Click to expand...

Congratulations

Did you consider leasing?
But with the six year financing purchase probably did have lower monthly payment, and no uncertainties of what might happen at end of the lease.

Click to expand...

Thanks, Tim. I'm really excited about this car.

I didn't consider leasing. I tend to buy a car and drive it for at least 10 years--longer if at all possible. (For example, our 2001 Subaru has 154k miles, and we still drive it daily.) I think that every analysis that I've seen indicates that this is the lowest-cost approach.

leafedbehind said:

MartinChico said:

Nissan and the local dealer have made the 2015 a much more attractive purchase (relative to the used 2011 model), so we bought the 2015 Leaf S w/Charge Package on Dec. 22, 2014. Here are the numbers that made this such a no-brainer:

TOTAL MSRP was $32,230, which included the following:
[Dealer discount: -$3,200.
Nissan rebate: -$3,500.
After these two deductions, the effective price was $25,530 (before any tax considerations).
After the federal tax credit of $7,500 plus a similar $2,500 from California, I have essentially bought the car for $15,530.
On top of all this, Nissan offered 0% financing for 72 months, so I took full advantage of this by only putting $3,000 down.

Click to expand...

Wow, that sounds like a great deal! And here I thought I was doing well getting my 2011 SL for "only" $23,000 after rebates, just 3 1/4 years ago. Of course you're paying sales tax as if the car cost $25,530, so that's an extra $1000 in effective price, but it doesn't matter. You can't get anything but a low-end gasser for $16K these days. Welcome to the club!

Click to expand...

Thanks! I'm very, very excited about the car and this technology and the bigger picture implications of the Nissan Leaf.

Here are a couple more economic considerations:

(a) It looks like we could easily save a net of $2,000/year (perhaps more) by doing some of our normal driving in the Leaf; this means that the car will pay for itself in 8-9 years. So it would be reasonable for me to drive this car for about a decade for free. (I still can't quite wrap my head around this!)

(b) I have free, L2 charging at my local Nissan dealer (2.1 miles from my house). I can drop off the car, run some errands on my bike, then return to a fully-charged vehicle a few hours later. I explain this as "FREE gas!" when asked about the Leaf.

Congratulations Martin. Now if you can convince someone to put in a QC somewhere in the Yuba City/Marysville area, you'll easily be able to travel to Sacramento and back. (You could do it now if you drove slowly, but you'll need to QC as soon as you get there.)

You'll find yourself using any excuse to drive the Leaf over your present gasser.

MartinChico said:

I didn't consider leasing. I tend to buy a car and drive it for at least 10 years--longer if at all possible. (For example, our 2001 Subaru has 154k miles, and we still drive it daily.) I think that every analysis that I've seen indicates that this is the lowest-cost approach.

Click to expand...

That has been my approach too.
The LEAF has been a very unusual situation that for some people leasing and then purchasing at the end of the lease turned out to be lower cost.
Did not work out that way for most people that leased 2011s.
Residuals were too high and they turned them in.
But NMAC has been losing so many $ at auction that on 2012 leases they have been offering $5,000 residual reductions if the leassors know to ask for it.
So more 2012 leasors at the end of lease are purchasing them.