Anyone else out there constantly shifting between modes

I use B as a downshift and travel at a distance were I rarely press the brake. I usually slow to about the last 15 feet and then apply the brakes if I need to stop or the person in front has a greater stop distance than normal or anticipated stop (greater than .5 car length from the car in front of them.

I use to drive the Leaf exclusively in B mode just for the predictable regen (slow down) feel. If I thought I would be able to coast a little more I go back to D or on freeway but for street stop and go traffic I prefer B. Just like shifting in my old manuals.

I am still new with mine and for traffic I keep it in ECO when it picks up I turn back to D to do 65ish.

I used to drive almost exclusively in B mode. But then I realized the most efficient use of momentum was letting it do its thing. Too much loss in the conversion back and forth. So now I'm actively shifting back and forth between B and D as I change areas I'm driving in. I almost never use Eco because, quite frankly, the lack of responsiveness takes most of the fun out of it for me. And the responsiveness is what I love most about the electric motor.

jjeff said:

My '13 seems to have gotten that right, ECO sticks and on both my '12 and '13S ECO and B are kind of integrated, IOW you can't have one without the other. Now my mothers '13SL has separate buttons, one for ECO that remembers even after power down and the B mode which like my '12 you have to double shift every time to turn back on.

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I'm wondering, for a 2011, is there any way to make ECO mode "stick" and be either the default mode when turned on, or even the only mode possible?

I'm a manual transmission type of guy who even loves driving old cars with crash-boxes that need double clutching to change gears.

I'm a terrible automatic car driver, always wanting to get the transmission to shift when I want it to, not when the car wants to. Mainly I like to engine brake. As such, even driving over several mountain passes I've never needed to change my brake pads on any vehicle I've ever owned.

As such, I also shift all the time in our Leaf, from drive to ECO to B to neutral. Sometimes I'm trying to hypermile, other times just trying to regen and save the brakes. For an example, I'll start slowing down in neutral. As I get close to where I need to turn or stop I take off ECO and shift into drive. Then as I get closer I turn on ECO again. And when I'm really close I shift into B. If I'm going down a long hill I've been trying a bunch of things. One, I turn on the cruise control and B mode and let the car just keep it's speed while bumping the Accel or Decel switch for corners. Or I switch between neutral, drive, ECO and B mode to maintain the speed I desire and for slowing down for corners. I've also tried shifting to B mode and using my foot to control the speed. Other than that I just keep it in ECO for accelerating and cruising. This is the fastest car I've ever owned and ECO just feels right.

However, I'm trying to give up on hypermiling so much, with the exception of when I need range. First of all I need there to be a level of comfort for the passengers, so I now just set the climate control to 70*F and turn on "Auto" and also drive about as normal as I can. Also, I find that when hypermiling I tend to not drive as safely.

hackdroot said:

After months of ownership, I think I've settled into my driving routine by now. I regularly shift between modes throughout my drives. On commute days, although I have a good buffer for my drive, I still try to get the most out of my drive as far as economy and range, so mode changing is rampant. But even on days where I know I have plenty of battery, I still use ECO and 'B' for slowing down since it's more beneficial for preserving the brakes and providing a bit of regen.

Driving around all the time in B isn't a situation I find myself in a lot since it acts like an anchor dragging behind the car and reduces the coasting in D which would be more economical in many situations.

My wife was in the car with me the other day and asked why I was shifting so much. I simply hadn't noticed the habit before so I was curious if others had adapted this driving style as well. I commuted with a manual transmission ICE for a LONG time, so I suppose it's not too foreign to me to shift constantly.

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I switch between B and Neutral. D mode only by accident.

DuncanCunningham said:

sdbmania said:

I don't shift a lot. Usually I use eco mode and B mode, but when I go on the freeway I turn off eco so that I can keep up with traffic.

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You can't keep up with traffic in ECO? I get the same max kw on full pedal in normal as I do in ECO. The mapping is just non linear in ECO, less on 0-50% pedal and it catches up near the end. I like a smooth acceleration progress. I'm not a hard gas, hard brakes, rinse and repeat that most US drivers do.

I can understand though that you don't need as much pedal movement in normal compared to ECO but the max power is the same so full pedal seems to match for me, maybe I'm wrong?

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No, you're correct about the power availability. It's a common misconception that Eco mode "reduces the performance", but as you say, it's really just re-mapping the pedal-response curve. Both modes give you the full 0 to 100% range. Though I think it's ECO that is actually the linear mapping. I.e., advance the pedal 20% and you get 20% torque. 40% and you get 40% torque and so on. With Normal mode, the car behaves like so many others, over-weighting the initial pedal response. Initial 20% pedal movement giving you much more than 20% of torque. Personally I find the linear mapping of ECO to allow more precise control. I like having power when I want it, and not jerking my passengers around when I don't. The "economy" aspect relies on the driver being fooled into the impression that less power is available, and accepting slower acceleration as a consequence of the setting, instead of simply moving their foot to get the desired torque level.

So I usually use ECO, for the better pedal-response curve. The only drawback is it also de-rates the HVAC so if it's really hot or really cold I have to go to Normal mode to get proper heat or cooling. I wish these functions were separated, and the driver allowed to select HVAC power levels like almost all cars USED to do. A knob or slider controlling the intensity of heat or cool. Too simple, I guess.

B mode I'm almost always in, unless I'm "hypermiling", which happens maybe once a year or less. Again, it's about controllability for me. I love the idea of 1-pedal driving and looking forward to seeing how the new implementation works.

Well Eco does reduce performance of the climate controls but I have to say my A/C works excessively well despite the reduced performance. I love the fact cool air is practically instantaneous. Especially recently when I am in and out of my car several times a day and its always sitting in an open parking lot baking away!

DaveinOlyWA said:

Well Eco does reduce performance of the climate controls but I have to say my A/C works excessively well despite the reduced performance. I love the fact cool air is practically instantaneous. Especially recently when I am in and out of my car several times a day and its always sitting in an open parking lot baking away!

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Oh, it does work well. It certainly helps to not have the condenser sandwiched with a boiling-hot radiator

But on really hot days, getting into a 100F+ sun-baked car, I rather have the AC working at max capacity to get the temps down. Sure, you can pre-cool with CarWings but that's even more wasteful as you're fighting heat that can be disposed much more efficiently once you open the windows.

But agreed, the vast majority of the time, the output on ECO is fine for me. It's really only the triple-digit days where I'm looking for more. Or, if it's below freezing and I want a quick warm-up. Those days are even rarer here.

I've played with ECO mode on and off for the climate controls and never noticed any difference in comfort level or energy consumption. Then again it rarely reaches above the 80's around here. I'm not sure how ECO works with the heater. When it's -40* the Leaf's heater just barely keeps up either way, if it's sunny, midday, parked in one spot, no wind.

I use B+ECO when I drive alone and dynamically (not slow).
I love 50kW limitation and ability to pass it with kickdown.

When I go crazy I do just B (or when vehicle is heavily loaded).

When I need to extend my range a lot and I drive like granny I go
D+ECO and often hold the shifter to left to engage N for coast.
I never let shifter go as I have to engage D soon anyway.

Regen is half-way efficient between friction brakes and coasting.
D mode without ECO is the most useless. It is very aggressive while
having almost no regen. Only use it for unreasonable racing.

When I back up usually shift between D/R rapidly without stopping.
Thank god Leaf allows reversing at speeds up to "jogging speed".
This makes maneuvering piece of cake. Hate stopping with brake pedal.
Did never stop with automatic nor manual (though only high end cars
allow that without grinding, like my BMW).

Like many on here, I use B mode to decelerate like a down shift, but typically drive in D. I have also stopped using ECO because it has a slightly more aggressive regen when coasting. Plus, I like the pep of the car, and not a fan of the squishy eco mode pedal feel.

I'm conscious enough of my driving to be easy on the accelerator for energy economy when I want to. With no eco and more coasting, I saw my mi/kWH go up 0.2. Now I'm getting 4.8-5.0 mi/ kWh, so not too shabby.


I'm looking forward to the regen paddle on the '18+ LEAF steering wheel. Should make driving economically more fun.

arnis said:

I use B+ECO when I drive alone and dynamically (not slow).
I love 50kW limitation and ability to pass it with kickdown.

When I go crazy I do just B (or when vehicle is heavily loaded).

When I need to extend my range a lot and I drive like granny I go
D+ECO and often hold the shifter to left to engage N for coast.
I never let shifter go as I have to engage D soon anyway.

Regen is half-way efficient between friction brakes and coasting.
D mode without ECO is the most useless. It is very aggressive while
having almost no regen. Only use it for unreasonable racing.

When I back up usually shift between D/R rapidly without stopping.
Thank god Leaf allows reversing at speeds up to "jogging speed".
This makes maneuvering piece of cake. Hate stopping with brake pedal.
Did never stop with automatic nor manual (though only high end cars
allow that without grinding, like my BMW).

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Coasting is more efficient than regen and puts less wear and tear on the battery (fewer cycles). Since I stopped using ECO and used my foot to regulate power, I've seen my mileage go up. I switch to B mode when I need to slow down more, and only use the brakes to come to a stop or to slow more quickly behind someone.

retrodog said:

I used to drive almost exclusively in B mode. But then I realized the most efficient use of momentum was letting it do its thing. Too much loss in the conversion back and forth. So now I'm actively shifting back and forth between B and D as I change areas I'm driving in. I almost never use Eco because, quite frankly, the lack of responsiveness takes most of the fun out of it for me. And the responsiveness is what I love most about the electric motor.

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This

I find that if you use Eco almost exclusively, your right foot gets "re-mapped" and you just step harder on the pedal as needed. Normal is just too touchy for me in traffic, at least.

I haven't really found a situation where I find it beneficial to stay in B for long periods of time other than aggressive downhill runs to control speed. Seems like even around town my 2013 B mode just slows the car down too much causing me to keep my foot into it more.

I do 'downshift' it into B coming into turns and to come to a faster stop, but find myself in D most of the time when my speed is consistent.

arnis said:

I use B+ECO when I drive alone and dynamically (not slow).
I love 50kW limitation and ability to pass it with kickdown.

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What is "50kW limitation"?

pyromancy5 said:

retrodog said:

I used to drive almost exclusively in B mode. But then I realized the most efficient use of momentum was letting it do its thing. Too much loss in the conversion back and forth. So now I'm actively shifting back and forth between B and D as I change areas I'm driving in. I almost never use Eco because, quite frankly, the lack of responsiveness takes most of the fun out of it for me. And the responsiveness is what I love most about the electric motor.

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This

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There is no meaningful difference in responsiveness between Eco and Normal. Any power level between 0% and 100% is available at any time in either mode.

Nubo said:

pyromancy5 said:

retrodog said:

I used to drive almost exclusively in B mode. But then I realized the most efficient use of momentum was letting it do its thing. Too much loss in the conversion back and forth. So now I'm actively shifting back and forth between B and D as I change areas I'm driving in. I almost never use Eco because, quite frankly, the lack of responsiveness takes most of the fun out of it for me. And the responsiveness is what I love most about the electric motor.

Click to expand...

This

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There is no meaningful difference in responsiveness between Eco and Normal. Any power level between 0% and 100% is available at any time in either mode.

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Maybe there is a breakdown in what you interpret to mean "responsiveness" Yes the power is there, but the remapped throttle creates a soft pedal feel. You need to push more on your foot to get an equivalent output from the motor. It literally responds less to user input.

pyromancy5 said:

Nubo said:

There is no meaningful difference in responsiveness between Eco and Normal. Any power level between 0% and 100% is available at any time in either mode.

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Maybe there is a breakdown in what you interpret to mean "responsiveness" Yes the power is there, but the remapped throttle creates a soft pedal feel. You need to push more on your foot to get an equivalent output from the motor. It literally responds less to user input.

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Sure, you do have to move your foot a little further in Eco if you want more power. On the plus side, you get more precise control at lower power levels. So I can get the car to 'respond' to any degree I desire, while at the same time I don't have to pay undue attention to maintain steady speeds, which constitue the majority of driving. This suits me perfectly and I don't consider moving my foot to be difficult or undesirable and I have no compunction against "flooring it". It's just different from how many ICE vehicles traditionally map throttle response so maybe feels uncomfortable to some because it doesn't match muscle-memory expectations or ICE-based perceptions of "how hard you are having to make the engine work". I think we just disagree on which aspect of responsiveness is important. As long as they continue to provide both options it's all good. I just want readers to know that the car isn't any slower or accelerate any less briskly in Eco mode, which is a commin misperception. As you say, it's just a different mapping of the pedal.