Battery Health

The 2011 G model I'm looking at buying has done only 5860 km (3660 mi) and has just arrived from China. The battery had a low SOC on arrival (% unknown but only about 11km (7 mi) range showing.

After an 80% L2 charge LeafSpy shows:

Ahr = 54.59
SOH = 83%
V = 385.82
ZE0-001843
Hx = 67.81%
8 QC, 152 L1/L2

min/avg/max = 3.983/4.019/4.029 (46mV)

temp = 17.4/17.4/16.8 Celsius

SOC = 81.1%

Also all cells are showing active shunts (red) except cell 7 (the only blue line), and cell 8 at 3.983V is the only cell below 4.000V

The dashboard shows 12 battery bars (small squares on the right) and 11 horizontal bars with a range of 121km (76 mi) available.

Can anybody decipher all of this please?

Thanks in advance.

The car should be showing 11 bars, although it may be just about to drop one. It also may have had the Battery Management System (BMS) reset to falsely show 12 bars of capacity. Given the 83% SOH, though, it would be hard to press a fraud complaint, AFAIK. Anyone who knows this stuff better, feel free to correct me!

Thanks LeftieBiker

Cell 8 has a significantly lower voltage than all the rest, so I wonder if it could be the main contributor to the battery's high internal resistance shown by the low Hx value? Is the replacement of a single cell generally feasible?

Have you heard of other cases of the BMS system being reset to restore the dashboard display? If so, then LeafSpy is the only thing we can rely on!

Before you worry about replacing cells, give the car a full 100% equalizing charge, letting it charge (preferably on L-1) until all the charge lights on the dash go out. Then drive the car to get the charge down at least a little. Do several 100% charges like that, then check with LeafSpy again. And yes, there have been cases of the BMS being reset. The true reading returns within a few weeks of driving.

Thanks again LeftieBiker

So the car has been driven about 20km and then given a 100% L2 charge. Can't do L1 here in NZ afaik because our mains supply is 230V. Here's the result:

After an 100% L2 charge LeafSpy shows:

Ahr = 54.51 (DOWN 0.08 Ahr from the previous 80% charge!)
SOH = 83% (no change)
V = 391.73V (UP 5.91V)
ZE0-001843 (is this the car's serial number?)
Hx = 67.61% (DOWN 0.2%)
8 QC, 153 L1/L2 (+1 L1/L2)

min/avg/max = 4.012/4.081/4.096 (84mV) (+.029/+.062/+.067 (+38mV) )

The weakest cell (Cell 8) is now reading 4.012V, up only 0.029V, while all the other cells have come up more than twice as much, making the 84mV difference also almost twice as much as before.

temp = 16.9/16.4/16.4/16.3 Celsius

SOC = 93.5% (UP 12.4%)

Again all cells are showing active shunts (red) except cell 7 (the only blue line)

Cell 7 is also slightly lower than the rest (except cell 8) at 4.058V. All the others are within a 30mV range 4.066-4.096V. Previously Cell 7 was in the middle of the pack and only Cell 8 was noticeably lower.

The dashboard is still showing 12 bars, and the GOM shows 146 km range.

I keep hoping the people with more experience will start replying, but in the meantime... The low Hx compared to the SOH seems suspicious to me. Either there is a bad cell (I think!) or the BMS was reset and the Hx is closer to reality. How much actual range does the car seem to have? (The GOM isn't very useful, but if you have a blue (IIRC) EV range button on the steering wheel, try looking at the more pessimistic inner range circle on that display. )

I would suggest just driving it for a few days. Run it down to around 30% and then charge to 100% overnight. Check the stats after a few daily cycles, and then see where you are.

LeftieBiker said:

I keep hoping the people with more experience will start replying, but in the meantime... The low Hx compared to the SOH seems suspicious to me. Either there is a bad cell (I think!) or the BMS was reset and the Hx is closer to reality. How much actual range does the car seem to have? (The GOM isn't very useful, but if you have a blue (IIRC) EV range button on the steering wheel, try looking at the more pessimistic inner range circle on that display. )

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I'm no expert here, but the numbers reported above are about the same as my 2011 was TWO years ago. I don't know why a 2011 would have less than 4000 mi on the odometer, but hopefully the car didn't cost too much. In any case, I'm now down to 47 AHr and 74% SOH, 53.7% Hx and 10-bars. The OP's car should last several more years. Enjoy!

Leaf Spy data looks good for a 2011 (age is the issue, not distance driven). Just drive the car and enjoy it. It is normal for SOH and Hx numbers to be significantly different, especially on 2011 and 2012. It may lose the first capacity bar relatively soon.

Gerry

I don't think that he bought the car... He only stated that "it was driven"..

If he bought the car, I think he should just drive the car and do a leafspy check every month or so... Since the car was not driven very much (150 charges only), I bet you that after a few months, the battery stats will improve... You can make yourself crazy by looking at all of those numbers so often. It's like a person worried that their car is burning oil and checks the oil every day... I would get tired of that fast.

powersurge said:

I don't think that he bought the car... He only stated that "it was driven"..

If he bought the car, I think he should just drive the car and do a leafspy check every month or so... Since the car was not driven very much (150 charges only), I bet you that after a few months, the battery stats will improve... You can make yourself crazy by looking at all of those numbers so often. It's like a person worried that their car is burning oil and checks the oil every day... I would get tired of that fast.

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Powersurge is rignt--my comments were written thinking the car was already purchased. If 90 km range is adequate and the purchase price is reasonable, it should be a good car for the OP. I still made my 52-mile (26 mi!es each way) commute in my 2011 with 8 capacity bars during the summer of 2013 before Nissan replaced the battery.

Gerry

Thanks everyone for your thoughts and encouragement, and sorry I haven't replied sooner.

So I decided not to buy this car because it's range wasn't showing any signs of improvement. Instead I've spent the last week in Auckland (600 km from home) and checked out a number of Leafs up there.

As a result I now own a Gen2 Leaf and have just finished driving it all the way home! I'm very pleased with it and I'll start a separate thread about it soon.

As a result I now own a Gen2 Leaf and have just finished driving it all the way home! I'm very pleased with it and I'll start a separate thread about it soon.

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While we haven't managed to agree on just what to call the 2013-2015 Leaf (I lean towards 'Leaf V1.5') you are definitely not going to be able to call it a "gen 2." ;-)

So what's your definition of a Gen2? Over here we identify Gen2's most easily by the extra boot space due to the charging hardware being shifted upfront, and the larger square-shaped "engine block cover" rather than the smaller rectangular version.

Mine has both of those features, but it also has the light-coloured interior trim while the dark trim is much more common on what we call Gen2's. For that reason I could probably go with Gen1.9

neville said:

So what's your definition of a Gen2? Over here we identify Gen2's most easily by the extra boot space due to the charging hardware being shifted upfront, and the larger square-shaped "engine block cover" rather than the smaller rectangular version.

Mine has both of those features, but it also has the light-coloured interior trim while the dark trim is much more common on what we call Gen2's. For that reason I could probably go with Gen1.9

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Wherever Leafs are manufactured, such as USA and Britain, the usual car market tradition is to look forward to model updates by year, and are referred to as 2013, 2014, 2015 etc to distinguish them - they are all Gen 1's but are seldom referred to in this way. Australia and New Zealand have no history of Leaf releases by year, and the Gen 1, Gen 2 terminology seems to have originated with the Leaf forums, and been taken up by the dealers, but it is not used anywhere else, so if you are posting in this forum you need to identify your Leaf by year of manufacture to be understood.

The term Gen 2 HAS been used by Nissan and motoring commentators to refer to a completely new design which the world may see in 2017.

The term Gen 2 HAS been used by Nissan and motoring commentators to refer to a completely new design which the world may see in 2017.

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Yes. The 2013 partial upgrade still uses the same powertrain (with a slightly different pack) and the same body (with steel parts replacing aluminum). People think of the next Leaf design, with a new body, powertrain, etc, as the Gen 2.

There is no gen 2 yet, just gen 1 with iterative upgrades.