GRA
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Re: Electrify America Network

Sat May 11, 2019 4:17 pm

    Leaf3540 wrote:I’ve read the horror stories about Electrify America being unreliable. They are true. Trying to get from Iowa to Denver. Grand Island Nebraska station is off line. Charged at a campground for 4 hours to make it to Lexington, NE. With a 78f battery, this station only puts out 13kW. Ogalala, is out of service so I can’t get to Fort Morgan, CO. Colby, KS is doable from Lexington as an alternative. It is out of service too. So far this trip, only Waukee, IA and Council Bluffs, IA actually work.
    Someone way up the thread said this network is a joke. It is a cruel joke. I did the trip because when I left, all stations reported “in service “ on the EA webpage. Don’t be fooled, this only means not under construction. You must phone in to the call center to ask if things actually work. This 11 hour drive in an ICE will take me 3 days.

    Thanks for the report. I take it you're "Blueberry II" on Plugshare? BTW, were the CCS working, or were they out too?

    The above information issue is one reason why they're going to real-time status info on a cell phone. Of course, the info actually has to be real-time to be useful, and it remains to be seen if that will be the case. Part of the problem is that teething issues with sites are inevitable - just ask Tesla. I had to add and remove some sites several times from the "open" list I kept in that thread, and plenty of owners got burned the same way you did with sites reported open that weren't by the time they arrived.

    The range of the cars combined with the long spacing between sites pretty much requires that you stop at every site to charge, just to make sure you have enough to get to the next site beyond (or before) it on your reserve. ICEs benefit from both longer range as well as the near-certainty that you will have another gas station within 30 miles if the one you plan to use is closed or broken. We're a long way from having that kind of density on any U.S. charging network, Tesla included, although a few heavily traveled routes may have it, so a much larger reserve is required.

    Personally, I don't consider EA's network really viable for CHAdeMO cars, simply because there's only a single charger per site so no redundancy. But, with virtually every manufacturer other than Nissan or Tesla (so far, in the U.S.) using CCS, I think that's less of a deal than it might be. Obviously, if you have a LEAF, that's not the case.
    Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

    The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

    DougWantsALeaf
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    Re: Electrify America Network

    Sat May 11, 2019 8:46 pm

    I have sent in comments to EA asking for at least 2 Chademo connectors. I am hoping that that heavy Leaf/Mitsubishi usage will push economics to have them offer 2 or 3 connectors.
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    WetEV
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    Re: Electrify America Network

    Sat May 11, 2019 9:03 pm

    DougWantsALeaf wrote:I have sent in comments to EA asking for at least 2 Chademo connectors. I am hoping that that heavy Leaf/Mitsubishi usage will push economics to have them offer 2 or 3 connectors.


    Economics is that Chademo is dead.
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    DougWantsALeaf
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    Re: Electrify America Network

    Sun May 12, 2019 10:55 am

    I disagree.

    1. Japan is staying Chademo and all makers are building with Chademo there.
    2. Chinese consortium has joined forces for new 400 kWh standard extending Chademo.
    https://www.google.com/amp/s/insideevs. ... ndard/amp/

    3. Europe and the US still have significant infra on Chademo with large bases of support east and west coast.

    4. Plug is same globally. (Ccs is different in Europe than In the US)

    All that said ccs is getting more new infra built then Chademo. Tesla now has adapters for both standards.

    In my head it all comes down to whether the Chinese decide to build infra in the US with their cars to promote their standard or not. That will tip the balance one way or the other.

    There are still 3000 plus chademos in the US and though slower, is still growing not declining.
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    GRA
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    Re: Electrify America Network

    Sun May 12, 2019 4:39 pm

    As all the EU and U.S. manufacturers decided on CCS from the start, the Koreans have abandoned CHAdeMO here for CCS and Honda is also using it, unless Toyota gets into BEVs in a big way here and they use CHAdeMO, I think it has no future here. The Outlander doesn't need it (there's always another gas station), so that leaves the LEAF and a dwindling number of Gen 1 Soul EVs, plus maybe a few other older low-volume BEVs I'm forgetting.

    CCS appears to be cheaper: two more wires on the same connector with two more pins, and a smaller door/less real estate required; compared to CHAdeMO's separate connector with four more wires and needing more real estate. As there's no major tech advantage either way, CCS seems to be the economic choice. As few cars will ever be shipped from one continent to another, the fact that CCS comes in two varieties is unlikely to be a significant factor.

    GB/T will almost certainly drive out CHAdeMO in China and possibly the rest of Asia, so that pretty much leaves Japan as the sole CHAdeMO-dominant country.
    Last edited by GRA on Mon May 13, 2019 3:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
    Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

    The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

    DougWantsALeaf
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    Re: Electrify America Network

    Mon May 13, 2019 6:13 am

    Sorry, I missed that the UK is still mainly Chademo. Leafs also sold out in both UK and Europe.

    China has declared partnership with Chademo, so Asia will likely line up behind the single standard.

    Ccs isn’t really cheaper.
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    jlv
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    Re: Electrify America Network

    Mon May 13, 2019 7:15 am

    DougWantsALeaf wrote:All that said ccs is getting more new infra built then Chademo. Tesla now has adapters for both standards.
    They have adapters for both, but not all cars can use them.

    The 3 in Europe comes with CCS. The CCS adapter is currently only for for the S/X in Europe with a Type 2 Mennekes.

    The CHAdeMO adapter doesn't work with the 3. It is only for the S/X.


    That said, I agree with what GRA said 2 posts up. CCS will be the dominant player in the US/Canada going forward. CHAdeMO may remain the winner in Japan, but I suspect it's days are numbered elsewhere.
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    GRA
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    Re: Electrify America Network

    Mon May 13, 2019 3:53 pm

    Two sites have opened, making 17 for the month and 173 total: Everett #1, WA (S.R. 99 W. of I-5); Patterson, CA (Jct. I-5/S.R. 130).

    Both provide a needed expansion of I-5 coverage, with more on the way.
    Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

    The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

    WetEV
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    Re: Electrify America Network

    Mon May 13, 2019 4:40 pm

    GRA wrote:Everett #1, WA

    ... a needed expansion of I-5 coverage, with more on the way.


    This Everett station will be mostly useful for non-I-5 traffic, such as taking the ferry to Clinton or Paine field. Getting off I-5 and onto 99 isn't suggested.
    Kinda like Colfax in Denver. Or El Camino Real in the Bay, but not as nice.

    https://www.plugshare.com/location/163260

    The interesting Everett station is:

    https://www.plugshare.com/location/163287

    Which is right off I-5.

    Or just to the North,

    https://www.plugshare.com/location/186859

    Or to the South.

    https://www.plugshare.com/location/186862
    WetEV
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    2012 Leaf SL Red (Totaled)
    2014 Leaf SL Red

    GRA
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    Re: Electrify America Network

    Mon May 13, 2019 4:46 pm

    WetEV wrote:
    GRA wrote:Everett #1, WA

    ... a needed expansion of I-5 coverage, with more on the way.


    This Everett station will be mostly useful for non-I-5 traffic, such as taking the ferry to Clinton or Paine field. Getting off I-5 and onto 99 isn't suggested.
    Kinda like Colfax in Denver. Or El Camino Real in the Bay, but not as nice.

    https://www.plugshare.com/location/163260

    The interesting Everett station is:

    https://www.plugshare.com/location/163287

    Which is right off I-5.

    Or just to the North,

    https://www.plugshare.com/location/186859

    Or to the South.

    https://www.plugshare.com/location/186862

    Yup, I was a bit unsure just how to describe this particular station, given that it will be surrounded by others (esp. the other one also on 99 but right off the exit), so decided to number it. I note that it's what appears to be the standard EA ''Urban" station going forward, i.e. 2 CCS/1 CHAdeMO/1 L2 rather than a "Freeway" station like Patterson with 3 or more CCS/1 CHAdeMO/no L2.
    Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

    The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

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