Help please selecting the right EVSE.

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J

jayl

Active member
Joined
Mar 14, 2016
Messages
25
Location
Maryland
Hi,

I was hoping to get some expert opinion on picking the right EVSE:

Here are my desired options:

1. future proof (as much as practically possible)
2. Ability to turn power off to the EVSE externally, not sure If I should get a switch installed for this.. or if there is an alternate method
3. Connected EVSE would be good to have, i am sure this will change to a must have down the road.
4. I really like the idea of JuiceBox Green..

With the above i have narrowed it down to 2 options i feel:

1. JuiceBox™ Pro 40 - Smart 40-Amp EVSE (https://emotorwerks.com/index.php/store-juicebox-ev-charging-stations/202-juicebox-pro-40-smart-40-amp-evse-with-24-foot-cable/category_pathway-23 )

2. HCS-40, 32 amp EV Charging Station, 25 ft cable with the Juice Plug in the future if I really care to have connectivity. ( http://www.clippercreek.com/store/product/hcs-40-32a-240v-charging-25-cord/ )

3. ClipperCreek HCS-40, JuiceNet™ Edition ( https://emotorwerks.com/index.php/store-juicebox-ev-charging-stations/juicenet-devices/1620-jn-cc40/category_pathway-40 )



Thanks for your help!.

-jay
 
Jay,

You won't go wrong with any of them.

No one can predict the future. You may buy a car in 2018 that can accept 60A for charging. We just can't anticipate everything.

As for switching input and plugging output, that's more related to electric code than to the EVSE. Some EVSE are certified with a plug on the input, but any can be adapted to a plug on the input if you're willing to deviate from approved configurations. If you get excellent quality plugs and sockets, the risk is very low. But it may not pass muster with an extremely knowledgeable code inspector.

Bob
 
It was very interesting to read your post as your thought process is pretty similar to where I was before I bought an EVSE.

jayl said:
1. future proof (as much as practically possible
Click to expand...

This will vary from person to person. I found a 40A system to be a happy medium with price and what second gen EVs might be able to use. I ruled out 32A system specially if they were in the same price range.

jayl said:
2. Ability to turn power off to the EVSE externally, not sure If I should get a switch installed for this.. or if there is an alternate method
Click to expand...

One can install a switch, but a plug in unit would sorta give you similar capability. You may not need this often but it is nice to have.

jayl said:
3. Connected EVSE would be good to have, i am sure this will change to a must have down the road.
Click to expand...

Absolutely. I got a non connected EVSE initially and swapped it out with a connected one. The additional features are nice if they matter to you.


As my signature says I went with JuiceBox 40 Pro and would do it again if I needed a second EVSE.
 
The OpenEVSE can be turned on and off at the push of a button. When turned off it says standby in the display and charging halts and the EVSE's connector opens removing the power on the J1772 cable. A RTC is also available and when enabled the display says waiting but normal operation resumes at a button push.
 
I too am starting to research the Juicebox Pro 40 model. I realize, in CA, they have started an interesting rewards program since late 2015.

They start off by giving you $100 off the EVSE for getting the Pro 40 model and allowing the utility company to monitor your charging usage.
Next up you earn up to $100-$150/year if you habitually charge overnight...this is a reward for not loading the grid at the wrong times..the utility company is able to verify this because they are monitoring your EVSE.

Essentially, if you exhibit good charging behavior, the EVSE will pay for itself in 3-4 years time..

Anyone signed up for this yet? I am starting to look into this seriously...sounds too good of a deal..
 
I have a older Juicebox premium and really like it. I believe it's rated for up to 60a but the EVSE cord is only 10 gauge and only rated for 30a so without swapping the cord it should only be used to 30a, which is just fine for my 27a Leaf. Mine isn't connected but does have a nice little remote for adjusting things like output current and such. It looks like Juicebox is currently trying a kick-starter campaign for their WiFi adapter that goes inline with any charging cable, $89 for CA residents, $139 for the rest of us :(
I don't believe the Juicebox units can be switched OFF, as I believe is the case with the vast majority of EVSEs but if you get one like mine it's easy to unplug it, in fact most of the time I carry mine around in the back of my Leaf for potential charging on the go. With it's ability to charge at anywhere from 6a and up and input voltage from 110v-240v with a wide variety of plug adapters I can charge at most any outlet I run into.
 
Mihird,

I am also interested in Juicebox since they are giving $100 off but I didn't know you can earn rewards in terms of $ after buying it as well.
 
That is true..read their Rewards Link on their website..if you allow PG&E to monitor your usage, there is some kind of reward program that they have built out to encourage you to charge in the night only..I am getting ready to order my JuiceBox Pro 40 shortly..

https://www.emotorwerks.com/index.php/rewards
 
has anyone bought this?

any thoughts on how it compares to JuiceBox pro?

http://www.amazon.com/ChargePoint-Amp-Cord-Plug-Station/dp/B0124KMODY/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1461350046&sr=8-2&keywords=chargepoint
 
jayl said:
has anyone bought this?

any thoughts on how it compares to JuiceBox pro?

http://www.amazon.com/ChargePoint-Amp-Cord-Plug-Station/dp/B0124KMODY/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1461350046&sr=8-2&keywords=chargepoint
Click to expand...

I thought about getting this one but went with JuiceBox PRO. Here's what I thought when I compared the two.

+ for JuiceBox
JB is a 40A system and ChargePoint home is a 32A system (future proofing point of view)
JB Costs about $150-$200 less

Same for both
Connected
Mobile App & dashboard
25 feet cable option
Plug in option available

+ for ChargePoint
Fancy LED light

Can't go wrong with either one.
 
jayl said:
has anyone bought this?

any thoughts on how it compares to JuiceBox pro?

http://www.amazon.com/ChargePoint-Amp-Cord-Plug-Station/dp/B0124KMODY/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1461350046&sr=8-2&keywords=chargepoint
Click to expand...
Note unless it's changed(which I doubt) none of the Juicebox EVSEs are UL listed. It didn't really matter to me but I've read here that some electrical inspectors were reluctant to sign off because of this. IMO unless your hard wiring your EVSE they should just inspect to the outlet but apparently sometimes this is not the case. Personally I'd just tell the inspector the outlet was for future use but I guess if you go into it stating it's going to be for your EVSE your kind of stuck :(
 
jjeff said:
Note unless it's changed(which I doubt) none of the Juicebox EVSEs are UL listed. It didn't really matter to me but I've read here that some electrical inspectors were reluctant to sign off because of this.
Click to expand...
Indeed, the National Electric Code requires all EVSEs to be listed (Section 625.5), so any inspector paying attention should fail any installation of any unlisted EVSE.

jjeff said:
IMO unless your hard wiring your EVSE they should just inspect to the outlet but apparently sometimes this is not the case.
Click to expand...
There are plenty of requirements in the NEC that extend beyond the receptacle or other outlet.

Cheers, Wayne
 
No Open source EVSE is NEC covered nor UL approved. The NEC requirements stop at the receptacle. UL approval may or not be a consideration. For example, I have heard the city of LA requires UL approval.

As far as my home city Anaheim, I just told the inspector that I was installing a 50A RV receptacle. An EVSE never entered the conversation. What you do after the permit is signed off is up to you.
 
jayl said:
has anyone bought this?

any thoughts on how it compares to JuiceBox pro?

http://www.amazon.com/ChargePoint-Amp-Cord-Plug-Station/dp/B0124KMODY/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1461350046&sr=8-2&keywords=chargepoint
Click to expand...
As far as future proof you may as well put in a 50 amp circuit and have 40 amp charging as a minimum.
Amazon is just 32 amps.
 
GlennD said:
No Open source EVSE is NEC covered nor UL approved. The NEC requirements stop at the receptacle. UL approval may or not be a consideration. For example, I have heard the city of LA requires UL approval.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately that is just not true. NEC definitely has requirements with regards to EVSEs and NEC definitely has things to say past the receptacle. Before commenting on the NEC and doing any further work which would be subject to the NEC I would strongly suggest you obtain a copy of it and maybe start with reading article 625 on EV charging systems.

FWIW: OpenEVSE is being used in EVSEs where are NRTL/UL listed.

GlennD said:
As far as my home city Anaheim, I just told the inspector that I was installing a 50A RV receptacle. An EVSE never entered the conversation. What you do after the permit is signed off is up to you.
Click to expand...

There are lots of way to get things past inspectors, in fact it's easiest if you just don't have them out in the first place, but I think if you are going to purchase a non NRTL/UL listed EVSE like the JuiceBox first installing a permitted/inspected receptacle for it before installing it is a good option as any inspector actually enforces the NEC should not pass it with the juicebox installed/plugged in.

I heard of someone locally who was building a new house and was just putting in the receptacle but the EVSE was in the garage of the house and the inspector saw and refused to sign off with it there because they knew it was just going to be installed and did not meet the requirements of the NEC.

And lastly double check with your utilities/city/state/etc. if you plan on getting and rebates from them to ensure that they do not require a NRTL/UL EVSE. emotorwerks is really shady in that they list my utilities $500 rebate on their website but nowhere that I've seen do they mention that the JuiceBox does NOT qualify.
 
GlennD said:
No Open source EVSE is NEC covered nor UL approved. The NEC requirements stop at the receptacle. UL approval may or not be a consideration. For example, I have heard the city of LA requires UL approval.

As far as my home city Anaheim, I just told the inspector that I was installing a 50A RV receptacle. An EVSE never entered the conversation. What you do after the permit is signed off is up to you.
Click to expand...
Thats a very good idea, better than my "for future use" response. Note this will only work for those that use a plug and not hardwire their EVSE but IMO thats the way to go, just all around more flexible. If you move, just simply unplug it and go, if you get a different EVSE just simply unplug it and plug in the new one.
 
QueenBee said:
GlennD said:
No Open source EVSE is NEC covered nor UL approved. The NEC requirements stop at the receptacle. UL approval may or not be a consideration. For example, I have heard the city of LA requires UL approval.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately that is just not true. NEC definitely has requirements with regards to EVSEs and NEC definitely has things to say past the receptacle. Before commenting on the NEC and doing any further work which would be subject to the NEC I would strongly suggest you obtain a copy of it and maybe start with reading article 625 on EV charging systems.

FWIW: OpenEVSE is being used in EVSEs where are NRTL/UL listed.

GlennD said:
As far as my home city Anaheim, I just told the inspector that I was installing a 50A RV receptacle. An EVSE never entered the conversation. What you do after the permit is signed off is up to you.
Click to expand...

There are lots of way to get things past inspectors, in fact it's easiest if you just don't have them out in the first place, but I think if you are going to purchase a non NRTL/UL listed EVSE like the JuiceBox first installing a permitted/inspected receptacle for it before installing it is a good option as any inspector actually enforces the NEC should not pass it with the juicebox installed/plugged in.

I heard of someone locally who was building a new house and was just putting in the receptacle but the EVSE was in the garage of the house and the inspector saw and refused to sign off with it there because they knew it was just going to be installed and did not meet the requirements of the NEC.

And lastly double check with your utilities/city/state/etc. if you plan on getting and rebates from them to ensure that they do not require a NRTL/UL EVSE. emotorwerks is really shady in that they list my utilities $500 rebate on their website but nowhere that I've seen do they mention that the JuiceBox does NOT qualify.
Click to expand...

Well then, I stand corrected. I was told that the NEC requirements stopped at the receptacle.

I do know that non UL approved units do not qualify for rebates.

Unless you have a Tesla or Tesla drive train car in your future than 30A is more than enough. The JuiceBox claims 50A with a Chinese claimed 80A relay. At half power it still runs warm, not hot. They get away with their ratings since no car draws 50A and the unit supplies the current the car requests ie a Leaf will draw 27.5A and ignore the rest.
 
It really boils down to is UL important to you. If you must have a UL approved unit then Clipper Creel or the frequently on sale at Home Depot GE units are the way to go.

If you want a unit with extra bells and whistles that is safe but not UL approved then the JuiceBox or OpenEVSE is the way to go. I have no interest beyond a basic unit but lately OpenEVSE has been pushing WIFI via the RAPI firmware. That is great if you are a millinal that is married to their smartphone but that is not for me.

Basically go with what is in your comfort zone. Neither unit is UL approved and it is not likely they will ever be approved no matter what the venders claim but they are safe.
 

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