Quick chargers broken at nearly every dealership in Utah

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cayblood

Member
Joined
Oct 11, 2014
Messages
7
Has anyone else noticed that the quick chargers at the dealerships are constantly out of order? They get fixed and then break again shortly thereafter. I've been talking about it with various dealership employees and they are saying that the dealerships were all encouraged to buy a specific brand that has had a 60% failure rate and now is no longer even manufactured. The dealerships are now upset that they are being told to install a new unit from Siemens that is supposedly more reliable, but they are of course expected to pay for it themselves (no support from Nissan).

Has anyone else had issues like this? What should we do to get Nissan aware of this problem?
 
cayblood said:
Has anyone else noticed that the superchargers at the dealerships are constantly out of order? They get fixed and then break again shortly thereafter. I've been talking about it with various dealership employees and they are saying that the dealerships were all encouraged to buy a specific brand that has had a 60% failure rate and now is no longer even manufactured. The dealerships are now upset that they are being told to install a new unit from Siemens that is supposedly more reliable, but they are of course expected to pay for it themselves (no support from Nissan).

Has anyone else had issues like this? What should we do to get Nissan aware of this problem?

Join the club here in CO. Two near me have been broken for months. This clear lack of support by the dealers of the product they sell is definitely pushing me to look at another brand come lease termination.
 
cayblood said:
Has anyone else noticed that the superchargers at the dealerships are constantly out of order? They get fixed and then break again shortly thereafter. I've been talking about it with various dealership employees and they are saying that the dealerships were all encouraged to buy a specific brand that has had a 60% failure rate and now is no longer even manufactured. The dealerships are now upset that they are being told to install a new unit from Siemens that is supposedly more reliable, but they are of course expected to pay for it themselves (no support from Nissan).
First off, you have your terminology wrong.

There are 3 incompatible DC fast charge standards in the US.

- Tesla Supercharger: See http://www.teslamotors.com/supercharger" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. There are currently 0 in UT and they're not usually installed at dealers anyway.
- CHAdeMO: http://www.chademo.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. This is what Leafs can use, when equipped w/the port.
- J1772 CCS aka Combo1 of SAE Combo - AFAIK, there are 0 of these in UT and somewhere between 15-25 operational ones in the entire US.

See http://www.mychevysparkev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5012#p5012" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; for pictures of the plugs. Yes, there are at least 6 incompatible plugs for DC FCing in the world.

Can you please give Plugshare URLs of the dealers you're talking about? URL to the Siemens DC FC you're talking about? I've never seen a Siemens CHAdeMO DC FC anywhere nor heard of any of the US. I see http://www.chademo.com/wp/chademocharger/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;, but I wouldn't be surprised if that's not a complete list.

Please indicate what this "specific brand is" that is allegedly no longer even manufactured.

Also, you posted twice in 2 different areas. Don't do that. One post got deleted for you. Also, can you please fix the title of your first post? Due to your terminology confusion, you've made for a confusing and misleading thread.

Nobody should be calling DC fast chargers which are NOT Tesla Supercharger a "Supercharger". That seriously only adds to confusion and folks who don't know any better will only spread it.
 
cwerdna said:
...

- Tesla Supercharger: See http://www.teslamotors.com/supercharger" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. There are currently 0 in UT and they're not usually installed at dealers anyway.
...

Just a small correction.
There are currently 30 supercharger stalls spread across 7 locations in Utah.
 
The chargers in question are Quick Chargers built by ABB and purchased by Nissan corporate.

Salt Lake City also installed 2 of these garbage chargers and they have been offline for months and ABB refuses to fix them.
Nissan corporate has done NOTHING to fix this problem.
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=8533&start=40#p392610" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Moderators please change the title of this thread.
 
Athe problems I keep seeing with the ABB units, other than the dirty filters, seem to be related to the controller (computer) being messed up. Seems like they are going to potentially be ditching a lot of expensive units because of the computer inside failing.

My favorite fast charger in our area is an efacec QC50 combo unit in Longmont. The transformer is about twice the size of the ABB units which may be why it continues to work so well. It's my understanding that the AeroVironment units nissan uses elsewhere can't be certified at our altitude so I'm worried if the ABB units keep failing, we won't have any QC's soon.
 
Zythryn said:
cwerdna said:
...

- Tesla Supercharger: See http://www.teslamotors.com/supercharger" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. There are currently 0 in UT and they're not usually installed at dealers anyway.
...

Just a small correction.
There are currently 30 supercharger stalls spread across 7 locations in Utah.
:oops: Whoops! I thought the list was alphabetical and didn't see UT. I stand corrected. But, those are totally incompatible w/the Leaf and not installed at dealers either.
 
cwerdna said:
Can you please give Plugshare URLs of the dealers you're talking about? URL to the Siemens DC FC you're talking about? I've never seen a Siemens CHAdeMO DC FC anywhere nor heard of any of the US. I see http://www.chademo.com/wp/chademocharger/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;, but I wouldn't be surprised if that's not a complete list.

Please indicate what this "specific brand is" that is allegedly no longer even manufactured.

Also, you posted twice in 2 different areas. Don't do that. One post got deleted for you. Also, can you please fix the title of your first post? Due to your terminology confusion, you've made for a confusing and misleading thread.

Nobody should be calling DC fast chargers which are NOT Tesla Supercharger a "Supercharger". That seriously only adds to confusion and folks who don't know any better will only spread it.

Please take it easy on a newbie. I apologize for posting in two places but I honestly didn't know which area was better and was worried about not being noticed. I edited the title. Others have clarified the brands in question--I honestly don't even remember. I'm just giving you what little I recall from a conversation with one of the employees at Ken Garff Nissan of SLC.
 
I had no idea that Tesla Superchargers would not work with Leafs. That is a real bummer. Will there be any way to remedy this in the future? I just assumed all the plugs and charging methods had been standardized.
 
cwerdna said:
:oops: Whoops! I thought the list was alphabetical and didn't see UT. I stand corrected. But, those are totally incompatible w/the Leaf and not installed at dealers either.

Very true, someday perhaps though (hope hope hope)
 
cayblood said:
I had no idea that Tesla Superchargers would not work with Leafs. That is a real bummer. Will there be any way to remedy this in the future? I just assumed all the plugs and charging methods had been standardized.

Tesla has offered to let other companies use them as long as they contribute to building out the network, and never charge for the use of them at the charger.
Basically, build the cost into the price of the car.

Speculation is that shorter range EVs wouldn't gain any benifit, however there may be some takers with the next gen cars.
 
cayblood said:
I just assumed all the plugs and charging methods had been standardized.
They are not. :( For DC FCing, CHAdeMO came first. Tesla Supercharger came next (in terms of deployment http://www.engadget.com/2012/09/24/tesla-supercharger/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;), but Tesla is dead serious about EVs and has been very serious about their Supercharger infrastructure.

CCS aka SAE Combo (announced before Tesla Supercharger, but deployment came WAY later) was from a bunch of automakers who aren't serious about EVs nor fast charging them, except BMW. It seems like their goal was to slow down Nissan by causing confusion amongst consumers, governments and businesses. See below.

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=183351#p183351" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=279363#p279363" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Some updates on this page http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=8968&start=80" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

And, http://insideevs.com/monthly-plug-in-sales-scorecard/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; has context about US sales numbers. On the list, the only two who support (as an option) J1772 CCS aka Combo1 variant of SAE Combo aka Frankenplug are the i3 and Spark EV.

While the Combo2 variant of SAE Combo may prevail in Europe, eventually, it sure doesn't look like that'll happen for North America unless more if its supporters get serious about it (e.g. actually produce cars w/that inlet and sell them nationally, invest in the infrastructure, legislative shenanigans, etc.) It prevailing in Asia also seems highly unlikely.
 
AlanSqB said:
. It's my understanding that the AeroVironment units nissan uses elsewhere can't be certified at our altitude so I'm worried if the ABB units keep failing, we won't have any QC's soon.
You mean Nissan/Sumitmo (http://nissanqc.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)? Those are the ones at Nor Cal dealers.

Altitude was mentioned at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=12668" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

Now that I think about it... perhaps those ABB units don't work well at high altitude either?
 
MikeinDenver said:
Join the club here in CO. Two near me have been broken for months. This clear lack of support by the dealers of the product they sell is definitely pushing me to look at another brand come lease termination.
yours is the only message for Nissan, either they get their "act" together regarding their support of EVs or the marketplace will do them in. The cars are not viable without the ability to charge.
 
Zythryn said:
Just a small correction.
There are currently 30 supercharger stalls spread across 7 locations in Utah.
not to be a nit piker but do you say that there are 8 fueling pumps found in one gas station? I think that noting the superchargers by location and not by actual charging stalls is the proper way to note them
 
cayblood said:
I had no idea that Tesla Superchargers would not work with Leafs. That is a real bummer. Will there be any way to remedy this in the future? I just assumed all the plugs and charging methods had been standardized.
Unless Nissan adapts their cars to the format embraced by Tesla the answer is no, there is remedy to this. The Tesla superchargers are funded by Tesla and are made available to Tesla owners for "free", the costs are wrapped into the purchase price of the car.
 
Greetings from Pennsylvania.
Our dealers have what looks like the Sumitomo Nissan branded DCQC chargers.
I only semi-regularly use one of them, and now that it is $5 a pop, I rarely use that one.
And yes, It is almost always down.

Last winter some guy "chipped the ice" out of the plug, and even though it's "fixed", it's never been right since.
Used it Friday.
Took 6 tries to get the plug engaged enough to pass negotiation with the car.

BUT MY BIGGEST GRIPE about this one (these?) is the power delivered.
The Sumitomo specs say this will deliver 44 kW maximum, and charge a fully depleted Leaf in 30 minutes.
Bu**%$ Sh#t!

I Have a nice Gid Meter system, and I can see what is actually happening.
The thing starts out with some nice power....say 40kW, and after 2 or 3 minutes, it stars falling like a stone.
In 10 minutes, It's down to 10 or 11 Kw.

While my meter and the chargers instrumentation agree on the output of the Charger, they seriously disagree on the SOC.
(and forget the GOM, It's really confused)
Since I'm paying for this, I really resent the discrepancy.
The DCQC charged me from 16% to what it said was 90%
It took 48 Minutes.
What it really did, was charge me from 16% to 76% in 48 minutes.

And yes, I understand the inverse voltage / current relationship, but that should be barely noticeable at 18% charge?!

Anyway, we have 4 of these within range.
One or more is usually broken.
We also have a Big Blink Chademo.
Now THAT THING can put out some juice!
It's sad when the most reliable charger within 50 miles is a Blink.

With my Brusa Add-on, I can get a far amount of charge from a full blown J1772 in the same amount of time.
And it won't cost me $5.00
 
apvbguy said:
Zythryn said:
Just a small correction.
There are currently 30 supercharger stalls spread across 7 locations in Utah.
not to be a nit piker but do you say that there are 8 fueling pumps found in one gas station? I think that noting the superchargers by location and not by actual charging stalls is the proper way to note them

It is a fair point and I used to agree.
Since the QC stations often have only one 'pump' at each 'station' I feel it is an important distinction and the reason I list both.
 
Zythryn said:
It is a fair point and I used to agree.
Since the QC stations often have only one 'pump' at each 'station' I feel it is an important distinction and the reason I list both.
I agree. The redundancy of Superchargers at each site is a big factor in making them reliable to use. The numerous threads about dead Chademo chargers, nearly always just one per site, makes the Supercharger model a big deal.
 
The Supercharger network is the main reason I am saving up my pennies for a Tesla after my Leaf lease is up. I still love the Leaf, but I also love the idea of an all electric drive to CA when I want to.

Right now, even a trip to the southern half of my state feels like an adventure.
 
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