DC charging on wheels. Charge while driving.

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camasleaf

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 26, 2010
Messages
662
Location
Camas, WA
I dream of the day when while I am driving my EV on the freeway to go from Seattle to Disney and the battery gets the LBW. All of the sudden a big truck labeled "The Ultimate Range Extender" and loaded with fast spinning electrons pulls in front of me and a connector starts to unreel of the back of the truck. My car goes on auto pilot and the charging port door opens. The car maneuvers by itself to receive the connector and it starts charging. 30 minutes later I am back to 80% and ready for another 200 miles of driving without stopping.

The technology is already available and the Leaf already has the charging port in the front :D .
 
This sounds like the way that jets refuel mid-flight. Works in the circumstances, but incredibly tricky, and requires zero interference.


Another option is solar panels on the car. The problem with charging while moving is the footprint. The car is just too small.
Even with 100% efficient solar panels, you're only looking at ~5kW power. Better than nothing, sure. But most people don't want to hobble around at 20MPH. And again, that's with 100% efficiency. Most panels are 15-18% efficient. Add to the fact that not all of the car is ever facing the perfect angle to the sun, and you're looking at like 500W power, tops.

It's certainly doable, but we need a massive change in perspective and driving habits to make it feasible. Also, don't expect to move a 2-ton car >5MPH with 500W.
 
Interesting thought, but our human body does need a break from sitting and driving. When we go on trips we try to stop every 1 to 1.5 hours, potty break, top off tank, if needed, etc. Walk around for at least 10 minutes.

If the DCQC network is available, then long distance travel with an EV would work. Until that day, let's just enjoy our WONDERFUL daily commuter vehicle for all our local driving. As it is we are on track to use all of our 15,000 miles per year allowance on our 3-year lease with just local driving, with almost all our charging being done in our garage with the installed 240v/30a EVSE on a 40a circuit.
 
If you want to do this while you're moving, you don't need DC at all. Just have a pickup truck pull your leaf and regen at nearly 30KW.
 
mctom987 said:
Another option is solar panels on the car. The problem with charging while moving is the footprint. The car is just too small.
Even with 100% efficient solar panels, you're only looking at ~5kW power. Better than nothing, sure. But most people don't want to hobble around at 20MPH. And again, that's with 100% efficiency. Most panels are 15-18% efficient. Add to the fact that not all of the car is ever facing the perfect angle to the sun, and you're looking at like 500W power, tops.

It's certainly doable, but we need a massive change in perspective and driving habits to make it feasible. Also, don't expect to move a 2-ton car >5MPH with 500W.

How is something an option or doable if it does not work even with driving habit changes? The change in perspective is walking and the solar won't move the car one inch under the best conditions.
 
I read once about a special car carrying system controlled by a computer that grabs your car from the top, lifts it, and then carrys it along at a very high speed. At the station closest to your destination it lets you off, and you drive the rest of the way on the batteries that were charging while the system was carrying you. I think it makes a lot of sense especially if there is no road. It would probably be cheaper to build this than another interstate highway system.
 
camasleaf said:
I dream of the day when while I am driving my EV on the freeway to go from Seattle to Disney and the battery gets the LBW. All of the sudden a big truck labeled "The Ultimate Range Extender" and loaded with fast spinning electrons pulls in front of me and a connector starts to unreel of the back of the truck. My car goes on auto pilot and the charging port door opens. The car maneuvers by itself to receive the connector and it starts charging. 30 minutes later I am back to 80% and ready for another 200 miles of driving without stopping.......snip......
It's already been done. I've seen that someone posted pic's on the web. You tow the Leaf behind another vehicle while in drive, foot off the pedal . . . . it's called 'regen'.
:D

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Sujv90PLLY[/youtube]
 
I'd rather have a road trip trailer option. You could provide 2 options, extra battery only or extra battery and/or generator. It could be gas, diesel or preferably propane. If it's propane you could even offer it with a grill on the back for camping. It could even have a fuel cell if hydrogen does take off the way Toyota and Honda think it will. You could also then use the top as a cargo rack which would be more efficeint than putting a roof rack on top of the car.


On a side note if hydrogen does take off it would be unlimited range for road trips and still fill at home overnight for commutes. The best of both worlds and all zero emmisions.
 
Home hydrogen requires large, expensive equipment... It is not likely to be practical or cost effective for quite some time...

minispeed said:
On a side note if hydrogen does take off it would be unlimited range for road trips and still fill at home overnight for commutes. The best of both worlds and all zero emmisions.
 
TomT said:
Home hydrogen requires large, expensive equipment... It is not likely to be practical or cost effective for quite some time...

minispeed said:
On a side note if hydrogen does take off it would be unlimited range for road trips and still fill at home overnight for commutes. The best of both worlds and all zero emmisions.


I wasn't refering to home hydrogen. I meant a rental trailer with a hydrogen fuel attached to a BEV for road trips that fills at home on electricity for commutes.
 
I don't get what's wrong with good old gasoline. It's simple, it's cheap, and even if you use a range extender powered by it once in awhile, you still are emitting far less carbon than you would be by having to rent a gas car for the trip since you could not afford a battery or hydrogen fueled range extender gor your leaf because of the high cost. I say keep it simple, keep it cheap. It's not going to be used that much.
 
johnrhansen said:
I don't get what's wrong with good old gasoline. It's simple, it's cheap, and even if you use a range extender powered by it once in awhile, you still are emitting far less carbon than you would be by having to rent a gas car .


Not true, you are better renting an efficient gas car or even better a hybrid, either choice will be more economical in fuel consumption.
 
I had wondered if a scheme could be set up where heavy good vehicles have a fitment at the back designed to tow EVs. They would stop off at sites where they can pair off with EVs wanting a tow-charge. The EV would carry around its own rigid extendible dolly/draw bar, and hook up to a willing trucker. Some fee would change hands, and off you both go.

Big diesels are very efficient at turning diesel chemical energy into motive power. As this is an additional load at constant speed to an already efficient engine, the 'additional' energy needed would be produced extremely efficiently. I would not be surprised if it was found to be 50% thermally efficient. The added energy-saving benefit is that the energy saved in pulling an EV directly in the aero-wake of a truck would equally save energy significantly, compared with energy consumed by the EV if it went along under its own power.

The scheme would be standardised such that the linkages would be to a given standard, schedules for matching HGVs to EVs could be put on line, EVs brakes would operated in much the same way as any braked trailer does, and a link to the cab would flag up information on the charge state of the EV.

...Just a thought....
 
EVDRIVER said:
johnrhansen said:
I don't get what's wrong with good old gasoline. It's simple, it's cheap, and even if you use a range extender powered by it once in awhile, you still are emitting far less carbon than you would be by having to rent a gas car .


Not true, you are better renting an efficient gas car or even better a hybrid, either choice will be more economical in fuel consumption.


I don't think that would be true. A properly designed generator gets to run at a set RPM constantly and therefore should be more effecient than any gas car, or even a hybrid that has to run through the rev range at various loads and sacrafice a lot of efficency for smooth and quiet operation. In an interview I read with a volt engineer they said they could have improved fuel economy while running on gas by holding a higher rpm but the noise and vibration was deemed to be unacceptable. If you run the generator putting out a higher output than required to simply move the car then the rest goes into the battery and eventually you will reach full charge and run without gas again. In any rental car eventually you will stop, idle, and have 0% efficency. Even with stop start there will be times when you just start, or are coasting down and have 1% efficency. A generator will never dip below a certain efficency and get down close to 0% unless something is wrong.

If the generator is in a trailer noise and vibration are a non issue, if the generator is a turbine or rottary noise and vibration can be cut down a lot and can be placed inside a car. The problem with placing it inside the car is the extra cost in packaging space and weight to lug it around when you never need it. Plus you then have to buy it up front instead of paying a rental fee to use it when you know you'll need it.

And for this purpose nothing is wrong with good old gasoline. Since I doubt we will ever see the commercial industry on 100% electric there will always be cheap liquid or gas fuel available to us be it gasoline, diesel, hydrogen, propane or natural gas.


To get back to the original post I think that if the tow truck industry switched over to hybrid trucks there may an option to set up DC to DC fast charging from the tow truck. It would be much safer to just pull over at the side of the road, hook up a chamedo/frankenplug and give you a fast charge than it would to tow to charge. With the time it takes just to hook up a tow truck to charge while pulling you could get a good enough charge from running the tow truck engine as a generator.
 
Ostensibly, AAA introduced quick-charging trucks to some of their fleets in 2011. I used one at Plugin Day or similar get-together in 2013, but in a recent call to AAA near Sacramento, they basically didn't know what I was talking (asking) about. I'm curious if anyone here has ever used one in a "true" roadside assistance setting.

AAA Introduces Emergency Roadside Charging for Electric Cars (plugincars.com, August 2011)
Level 3 Roadside Charging from AAA (showtimesdaily.com, October 2011)

I like the towing method, though!
 
Staque said:
If you want to do this while you're moving, you don't need DC at all. Just have a pickup truck pull your leaf and regen at nearly 30KW.

What if . . . You had two LEAFs, towed one to charge it by regen, then switched cars and charged the other one? Could it work?
 
DNAinaGoodWay said:
Staque said:
If you want to do this while you're moving, you don't need DC at all. Just have a pickup truck pull your leaf and regen at nearly 30KW.

What if . . . You had two LEAFs, towed one to charge it by regen, then switched cars and charged the other one? Could it work?
Probably not.
Ignoring the fact the leaf couldn't tow anything half that weight, the system would be so inefficient that it wouldn't be worth it. You'd be far better off just ripping the battery out of the second Leaf, and hooking it up in parallel to the first Leaf.
 
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