Why buying a Nissan is going to be more challenging unless Congress acts

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armmynissanleaf

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 5, 2014
Messages
98
EV Tax Credit is ending soon.

Between the higher prices they cost, the extra home charging equipment they need, and the reluctance or reticence we all have about purchasing them, buying an electric car nowadays does present its challenges. As if the car purchasing process isn’t complicated enough, the prices of some of the most popular EV models presently offered are about to become more painfully expensive unless Congress does something about it.

Electric Sticker Shock: As the Electric Vehicle Fed

What do you think the Congress should do? Prolong the EV Tax Credit or decrease is gradually?
 
Congress should do nothing IMO. (and Congress seems to be very good at doing nothing)

Let the EV credit taper off as scheduled. The credit should only be to jump start the manufacturers into the market, not a permanent revenue stream.

If Congress wants to continue discouraging gas over and supporting electric then an additional 5 cents can be added to the gas/diesel fuel tax each year.
Need more Grinch and less Santa or the government will be broke.
 
While I appreciate the tax credit and Calif. rebate allowing me to buy a better car, I do concur that much higher gas taxes would be a better long term approach to converting the country to EV.

However, for that approach to work, the gas tax pain has to become quite substantial. Here in Calif., we have higher gas taxes and regulatory costs contributing to us having average gas prices 28% higher than the national average (as of AAA 6/26 data). I haven't seen a large portion of the people here fretting over that extra 82 cents per gallon cost of gas and shying away from the mega-SUVs. So an extra 5 cents isn't going to cut it. The increase will need to be multiple dollars per gallon. Good luck getting that through Congress.
 
Taper off the EV credit or increase the "gas guzzler" tax and apply it to all vehicles that are driven except commercial truckers. Yes even Joe Schmoe the Plumber/Handyman/Whatever that uses the F350 as his "work truck" as well as everything else should start getting 20%-25% tax on their purchase. If you get less than some magic number that increases every year, you pay the tax. This administration likes simple right?
 
2k1Toaster said:
... increase the "gas guzzler" tax and apply it to all vehicles that are driven except commercial truckers.
Why would you exclude commercial trucking ? Let people pay the actual cost of their consumption, and don't give truckers an incentive to continue using highly polluting vehicles.
 
smkettner said:
Let the EV credit taper off as scheduled. The credit should only be to jump start the manufacturers into the market, not a permanent revenue stream.
Sure, in isolation. But for now that subsidy is not even coming close to off-setting the externalized costs of petrol.
 
DarthPuppy said:
While I appreciate the tax credit and Calif. rebate allowing me to buy a better car, I do concur that much higher gas taxes would be a better long term approach to converting the country to EV.

However, for that approach to work, the gas tax pain has to become quite substantial. Here in Calif., we have higher gas taxes and regulatory costs contributing to us having average gas prices 28% higher than the national average (as of AAA 6/26 data). I haven't seen a large portion of the people here fretting over that extra 82 cents per gallon cost of gas and shying away from the mega-SUVs. So an extra 5 cents isn't going to cut it. The increase will need to be multiple dollars per gallon. Good luck getting that through Congress.

50 cents a year, every year, for 10 years. Painful but enough time to plan and make changes.
 
Nubo said:
50 cents a year, every year, for 10 years. Painful but enough time to plan and make changes.

I concur that should be effective. Getting to a $5.00 per gallon tax by 2030ish should get the job done. But I don't see any chance of getting something like that through Congress. So the federal tax credit/state refund schemes are probably the best we will be able to accomplish. It will probably take another decade of climate change to get enough political muscle to implement such an effective gas tax approach. And by the time that happens, we would be looking at it not getting the job done until 2040ish.
 
SageBrush said:
smkettner said:
Let the EV credit taper off as scheduled. The credit should only be to jump start the manufacturers into the market, not a permanent revenue stream.
Sure, in isolation. But for now that subsidy is not even coming close to off-setting the externalized costs of petrol.
You could make EVs free and you would not pay a nickle toward external costs.
Need to collect a tax to have users pay external costs.

5 Cents a gallon each year may not seem like much but it would accumulate faster than a failed attempt at 50 cents.
 
smkettner said:
SageBrush said:
smkettner said:
Let the EV credit taper off as scheduled. The credit should only be to jump start the manufacturers into the market, not a permanent revenue stream.
Sure, in isolation. But for now that subsidy is not even coming close to off-setting the externalized costs of petrol.
You could make EVs free and you would not pay a nickle toward external costs.
Need to collect a tax to have users pay external costs.
.
What is the externalized cost of something that does not occur ?
 
armmynissanleaf said:
EV Tax Credit is ending soon.
Huh? No it's not.

This article is a saying: some mfgs are reaching the 200K cutoff of the tax credit, and it will no longer be available to them. That's as intended. Actually, I found the article not very good. Although, it did say this:
Coming in as the next closest are Nissan and Ford with around 120,000 and 108,000 units respectively, and aren't expected to reach 200,000 for several years.
So I fail to see how "buying a Nissan is going to be more challenging" is true.
 
jlv said:
armmynissanleaf said:
EV Tax Credit is ending soon.
Huh? No it's not.

This article is a saying: some mfgs are reaching the 200K cutoff of the tax credit, and it will no longer be available to them. That's as intended. Actually, I found the article not very good. Although, it did say this:
Coming in as the next closest are Nissan and Ford with around 120,000 and 108,000 units respectively, and aren't expected to reach 200,000 for several years.
So I fail to see how "buying a Nissan is going to be more challenging" is true.

I agree, I think the challenge will be more for Tesla first then Nissan second based on USA sales numbers, but I doubt it will decrease sales anytime soon given that GAS prices have been on the rise this year. What drives sales towards alternative vehicles are gas prices as said here in this thread by others. What I see taking place first is the Hybrid community will continually outpace EV given the change is how the EV works. With ~20 miles EV to augment gas with an EPA saying of ~60 miles per gallon equivalent will satisfy a lager purchasing crowd. I see that as a bigger threat to going all electric and Nissan sales etc.
 
This would solve LOTS of issues, including the EV rebate:
https://citizensclimatelobby.org/carbon-fee-and-dividend/

Start charging for externalities. Not only that, but people get paid for the increased prices.
Those that are energy efficient, actually get paid more than the increased costs.

This also would lower the need for additional government regulations, and may even allow the repeal of some existing regulations.
It also stimulates the economy.

There are aspects of this that appeal to2 liberals, conservatives, libertarians or even socialists.
 
techiefan said:
I think the challenge will be more for Tesla first then Nissan second based on USA sales numbers,
The effect on Tesla will probably be somewhat different than the effect on Nissan. Tesla sells very few $35K EVs despite what you hear from Elon Musk. The loss of the $7.5K federal tax rebate on a $50-100K vehicle is somewhat different than the effect on EVs at the bottom end of the price range. Having said that, it will be a while before Nissan EV sales hit 200,000 and that only triggers the beginning of a several step reduction in the rebate which will take something over 18 months.
 
Dooglas said:
Tesla sells very few $35K EVs despite what you hear from Elon Musk.
Tesla has sold 0 EVs for $35K (and 0 EVs for under $49K). I don't think Elon Musk has said otherwise.
 
jlv said:
Dooglas said:
Tesla sells very few $35K EVs despite what you hear from Elon Musk.
Tesla has sold 0 EVs for $35K (and 0 EVs for under $49K). I don't think Elon Musk has said otherwise.
You do understand that my point was that the loss of the federal tax incentive will have a proportionally smaller impact on Tesla than on Nissan due to the higher price of the Tesla vehicles. Sounds like you agree with me. (thought it is a matter of record that Elon Musk said the base price of the Tesla 3 would be $35k when he announced its initial availability for order/reservation, and Tesla has repeatedly said that a base model 3 would be available at some point)
 
SageBrush said:
smkettner said:
SageBrush said:
Sure, in isolation. But for now that subsidy is not even coming close to off-setting the externalized costs of petrol.
You could make EVs free and you would not pay a nickle toward external costs.
Need to collect a tax to have users pay external costs.
.
What is the externalized cost of something that does not occur ?

That is a common concept in the stock market,
Stock usually drops when something doesn’t occur that investors expect.

No idea what it is in this context
 
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