What to look for when inspecting a used Leaf?

I'll be checking out a used 2013 Leaf SV, no options, with 20k miles. The car is in carmax in Florida, clean carfax report with one previous owner in Florida. What should I look for when inspecting the car besides the 12 bars? What loose items come with it? How many charging cables? Pouches? Anything under the trunk? What should I look for under the hood? Anything else you can think of? Thanks.

Make sure it has the charging cable. My friend bought a Leaf from CarMax, after he drove it home he found out charging cable is missing.
CarMax had no idea what it is and wasn't going to provide, luckily one of the picture of his car on CarMax website has the charging cable in the trunk. CarMax provided at last.

I'm sure this has been answered elsewhere, but when buying a used Leaf, you should:
1) Verify battery capacity with a GID meter (LeafDD, LeafSpy, etc.)
2) Verify it has not been "opted out" of the battery warranty settlement (although this may not matter)
3) Should come with an L1 EVSE (which you should have modified to L1/L2)

That's it: the rest of the car is bullet-proof.

I have the same (rather basic) questions about inspecting a 2012 SL (48K mi/$10,500... good deal?)... should I be looking for anything different?

Also does the 2012 SL have the 'intelligent key'?

And lastly- I am in Florida... anything I should be aware of in terms of battery degradation? (I have an 07 Prius whose hybrid battery just failed at 102K miles- 2K out of warranty- and cost $1500 to replace... Toyota paid 50%)

And finally- could I charge overnight on a regular household outlet? Is it safe to run an extension lead into the driveway for this or does it have to charge indoors?
Also- how would I know if it would fast charge at the (unused) charging station at my workplace?

Thanks in advance and apologies for dumb questions- I am excited about the prospect of owning one of these amazing vehicles!

Paul

tvspaulmoore said:

I have the same (rather basic) questions about inspecting a 2012 SL (48K mi/$10,500... good deal?)... should I be looking for anything different?

Also does the 2012 SL have the 'intelligent key'?

And lastly- I am in Florida... anything I should be aware of in terms of battery degradation? (I have an 07 Prius whose hybrid battery just failed at 102K miles- 2K out of warranty- and cost $1500 to replace... Toyota paid 50%)

And finally- could I charge overnight on a regular household outlet? Is it safe to run an extension lead into the driveway for this or does it have to charge indoors?
Also- how would I know if it would fast charge at the (unused) charging station at my workplace?

Thanks in advance and apologies for dumb questions- I am excited about the prospect of owning one of these amazing vehicles!

Paul

Click to expand...

$10,500 seems at least $2k too much. Here's a 2011 SL with less miles asking $8,400.

YES, you must be aware of battery degradation!!! Read the previous comment about verifying the battery capacity and at the very least note how many skinny bars remain in the rightmost part of the display. With Florida's heat it's very likely that car's battery is badly degraded - expect around 70% of new capacity. If it's "very very" degraded, that could actually be good, as you might get a new battery under warranty, but with only 12k miles to go before that warranty expires that could be a big gamble. Another important factor to consider is whether it has a QC (Chademo) port.

Yes charging in the driveway off a standard outlet is fine. But if you're using an extension cord make sure it's in good condition and uses at least 12 gauge wire (smaller number = bigger wire = better), and make sure the outlet itself is in good shape and the circuit is otherwise unloaded.

tvspaulmoore said:

I have the same (rather basic) questions about inspecting a 2012 SL (48K mi/$10,500... good deal?)... (snip) I am in Florida... anything I should be aware of in terms of battery degradation?

Click to expand...

Yes, degradation will be an issue with that vehicle. How far do you need to drive? That price seems a bit high, by the way.

tvspaulmoore said:

And finally- could I charge overnight on a regular household outlet? Is it safe to run an extension lead into the driveway for this or does it have to charge indoors?

Click to expand...

Generally speaking, using an extension cord is not a safe option. You can charge overnight using a regular outlet, but make sure the outlet can handle a continuous 8A load. (You may have to get an electrician to inspect your wiring and junction box.) The ideal option is to install a new 240V outlet and either modify your EVSE or get a L2 charger. It can get expensive though.

tvspaulmoore said:

Also- how would I know if it would fast charge at the (unused) charging station at my workplace?

Click to expand...

As long as the charging station at your work is a standard L2 charger, it will work with ALL models of Nissan LEAF.

The only way that I would buy a 2012 with that many miles is if I know they didn't opt out of the capacity warranty and the car was very close to qualifying for a replacement, but that's still a gamble and if for some reason the battery doesn't degrade enough, you're SOL.

You may want to consider walking into a dealer and seeing what they will offer you on one of the 2015 S w/QC cars on their lots? I'm hearing that they are nearly giving them away. People are saying that they are getting $5K off for NMAC financing, additional $5K dealer incentive, and if you qualify for the $7.5K tax credit, the car will be about $17K out the door. If you buy a used one and wind up having to put a new battery in it, you'll be in a similar or worse position. If you consider this route though, still buy an OBD reader and get an app to test the battery. You'll want the newest mfg car on the lot and you still want to take a reading of the pack.

Another thing to keep in mind when buying used is the tire wear. The stock tires wear fast so you may find yourself with a $600 expense soon after. You could get lucky and find a used car that recently replaced them.

One other item to check for is the Nav SD card. Those seem to go missing quite a bit and apparently they are an expensive pain to replace.

"Generally speaking, using an extension cord is not a safe option. You can charge overnight using a regular outlet, but make sure the outlet can handle a continuous 8A load. "

Correction: Make that a 12A load. The Nissan (Panasonic) EVSE that comes with the car draws approximately 12A.

As for extension cords, I agree with aarond12. The outlet of the cord can wear without you knowing it. Also, the wire near the plug and near the outlet can fray inside without you knowing it, just from the normal flexing of using it. You'll be operating at high current for many hours unattended, so if something does go wrong, it can be really bad, potentially causing a fire. That's probably why Nissan does not recommend any extension cords with their EVSE.

But, in my opinion, an extension cord can be safe, but only if it is a quality extension cord with heavy gauge wire and in very good condition.

Bob

Thanks for all the answers and suggestions!

Agree the car I saw might be overpriced but in FL (at least where I am in Tampa Bay area) there aren't many on the market which might prevent prices being driven down

I wish I could afford to haggle down a new model but the only reason I'm even in the market for one is because I can stretch to around 10K- even 15K is beyond my budget

A couple (more) questions...

- How do I check for a QC port?
- How/where do I check for Nav SD card?
- How would I know if the battery has been opted out of the capacity warranty?
- Where is the best/cheapest place to get an OBD reader?
- What is Nissan's standard battery warranty?

Lastly- I mainly want the SL for the backup camera since I like having it on the Prius (and making myself feel I have a fancy new car with a touchscreen)- any counter arguments for getting an S or SV?

thanks all

How do I check for a QC port?

Release the charging cover. There is a button to do this on the dash and another button for this on the key fob. Inside, you must have a normal connector on the right, covered by a flip-up orange protector. Look on the left. You may or may not also have a larger connector for QC on the left.

- How/where do I check for Nav SD card?

The radio/video display flips open by pushing a button on the bottom of the radio display once. It will swing up so that the LCD display is pointing to the sky, exposing two SD slots. The right slot contains an SD with maps and other vital info and comes with a new car. The left slot is normally empty. If both slots are empty, that's bad.

- Where is the best/cheapest place to get an OBD reader?

On ebay or dx.com, you can buy an ELM327 bluetooth device that plugs into the OBD connector and works with your smartphone. That's the cheapest solution (if you have a smartphone), at <$15.

- What is Nissan's standard battery warranty?

http://www.nissanusa.com/electric-cars/leaf/charging-range/battery/

"Every US specification Nissan LEAF® is backed by a New Vehicle Limited Warranty providing: 36-month/36,000-mile basic coverage (whichever occurs earlier); 60-month/60,000-mile powertrain and electric vehicle system coverage (whichever occurs earlier); and 96 months/100,000 miles Lithium-Ion Battery coverage ..."

http://www.autotrader.com/car-news/2013-nissan-leaf-gets-new-battery-warranty-201645

"Under the new warranty, Nissan will repair or replace a Leaf's battery within five years or 60,000 miles if it loses more than 30 percent of its charge capacity. For Leaf owners, that means the warranty kicks in if the 12-bar battery gauge falls under nine bars. The new warranty is the second for the Leaf's batteries; the first covers defects and flaws for up to eight years or 100,000 miles."

"Nissan says it will extend the warranty to 2011 and 2012 Leaf models, helping those with batteries that are already losing charge."

Lastly- I mainly want the SL for the backup camera...

Check the car to see what it has. Some models come with the "all around" camera as an option. Getting an SL doesn't insure that you get a camera.

Bob

Thanks for the reply which I only just saw- apologies for delay

Thanks for all the info!

I have seen a 2012 S this week (actually first sold Dec 2011) which has 11K miles for just under $10K. Has NAV but no camera. Appears to have no 'left' charging port

How do I know if it has a 6.6KW charger? Sales staff said it did (but they also thought it had backup camera and it did not)
Would this be reflected in the recharge times in the dash display? I've seen some online with three times displayed (240 6kw, 240 3kw, 120v) but assuming there's another way of confirming...?

Thanks for any replies!

tvspaulmoore said:

Thanks for the reply which I only just saw- apologies for delay

Thanks for all the info!

I have seen a 2012 S this week (actually first sold Dec 2011) which has 11K miles for just under $10K. Has NAV but no camera. Appears to have no 'left' charging port

How do I know if it has a 6.6KW charger? Sales staff said it did (but they also thought it had backup camera and it did not)
Would this be reflected in the recharge times in the dash display? I've seen some online with three times displayed (240 6kw, 240 3kw, 120v) but assuming there's another way of confirming...?

Thanks for any replies!

Click to expand...

I don't believe an S model without quick charger will have a 6.6kw charger. The S model comes stock with the 3kw charger, and the DCQC (CHAdeMO) package includes the 6.6kw charger upgrade. Well that is the case for 2013, anyway...

Thanks for the info

Am I to understand the quick charging port= the presence of a 6.6KWh charger?

Would I miss not having one? Would it negate the benefit of being able to use a free commercial-grade parking lot charger at my workplace?

tvspaulmoore said:

Thanks for the info

Am I to understand the quick charging port= the presence of a 6.6KWh charger?

Would I miss not having one? Would it negate the benefit of being able to use a free commercial-grade parking lot charger at my workplace?

Click to expand...

On the S model you have to have a QC port to have the 6.6kw charger. As for whether you'd miss it, if you will be charging for hours at work, then probably not. The 6.6 charger is most missed in short "opportunity charging" situations, when you want to get as much charge in as little time as possible.

Thank you

I do have a (yet another!) question which I couldn't figure out which keywords to use to find an existing answer for (!)- if I buy an OBD dongle and download Leafspy, what reading am I looking for to determine the quality/lifespan of the car/battery- or am I misunderstanding the purpose of such a check?
Assuming also the only useful thing my regular ICE shop could check if I had them look it over prior to purchase would be tire treads and brakes?
(Outside of big cities with EV specialists am I stuck with a Nissan dealer for any maintenance?)

You can sign up for a consult with my service. They are free as a ramp up the business.

www.theevconsultant.com

tvspaulmoore said:

I have seen a 2012 S this week (actually first sold Dec 2011) which has 11K miles for just under $10K. Has NAV but no camera. Appears to have no 'left' charging port

How do I know if it has a 6.6KW charger? Sales staff said it did (but they also thought it had backup camera and it did not)
Would this be reflected in the recharge times in the dash display? I've seen some online with three times displayed (240 6kw, 240 3kw, 120v) but assuming there's another way of confirming...?

Click to expand...

There's no such thing as a 2012 S. In 2011 and 2012 model years, there were ONLY SV and SL trims, which both have nav. Also, NO 2011-2012 Leafs from the factory have an on-board charger higher than 3.x kW. (There is a 3rd-party Brusa charger upgrade that came later but the chances of finding a used one of that are almost nil.)

2013 was the first year of the lower cost S trim, which has NO nav, not even as an option. It also has dull grey plastics around the center console and knobs for the stereo and HVAC vs. no knobs (http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=445209#p445209, also interior pic and video of an S at http://insideevs.com/real-world-test-2013-nissan-leaf-range-vs-2012-nissan-leaf-range/).

2013 was the first year for a 6.x kW OBC, standard on the SV and SL, optional on the S (part of the "charge package" which adds a CHAdeMO inlet, as well). On 2013-2015 SV and SL, they all come with 6.x kW OBC, regardless of whether it has CHAdeMO inlet.

Yes, 6.x kW OBC equipped car (i.e 2013+ SV and SL, 2013+ S w/charge package) will show 3 estimated times for charging: 240V 6 kW, 240V, 3 kW and 120V.

Oh yes, and ALL 2011-2016 Leaf SV and SL come with nav.

As for Leaf Spy, you want the "Hx" and "SOH" readings. They are essentially the same thing, and this "state of health" shows you how much of the original capacity is left, more or less.

tvspaulmoore, BTW, since it sounds like the car is actually a 2012 SV w/o CHAdeMO, in my book, just under $10K is way too high.

See my replies at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=435921#p435921 about how I felt a 2011 SL w/new lizard battery replaced via capacity warranty (http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=17168 http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?t=13192) also w/o CHAdeMO was too high at $8,990.

http://sfbayleafs.org/news/2013/01/2013-nissan-leaf-product-highlights/ is an overview of what was new w/the 2013 model year.

http://sfbayleafs.org/commentary/2013/09/2013-vs-2011-nissan-leaf-whats-new-whats-gone-whats-changed/ has more, but that guy has a 2013 SL. He has the premium package (Bose stereo and Around View Monitor). 2013 SL came w/CHAdeMO inlet and leather black interior. (Specs tab of http://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/usa/presskits/us-2013-nissan-leaf-press-kit may help.)