WiFi capabilities on Leafs

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Webguy

Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2013
Messages
5
There's no reason why Leafs shouldn't have WiFi capabilities. In private homes, its a no brainer. The advantage of remotely controlling nav routes, charges and climate control will be far more efficient. Public wifi enabled areas offer similar benefits, if the Leaf user is afforded the option to utilize it.
 
garygid said:
There are some security issues, I believe.

Who says there aren't security issues right now?

I agree with OP, there should be some way to communicate with the Leaf "locally" - be it bluetooth or wifi. It's silly that when I am in my living room and I want to turn on climate control, I depend on a cellular network to do so. There are many times when I can't turn on my CC because I am in a poor coverage area when either my phone has no signal, or the car.... yet I am a few hundred feet from my car.
 
Don't count on Automakers to ever add recent tech innovations to their the cars. Sadly, it appears this will always be up to the aftermarket.

I am working on some solutions to these issues and more.

I really wish they would simply add a firewalled head unit running Android and open it up to the free market Android ecosystem. This would solve the problem while also removing the burden of innovating in this area so they can concentrate their resources on doing what they do best; building cars, while leaving the infotainment innovation to an industry that can move faster.

By the time a typical automaker product development cycle completes (2-5 years) any infotainment tech they both with is already hopelessly outdated. Hopefully other automakers will take a cue from Tesla.

-Phil
 
If one could connect a Leaf to wifi by plugging a wifi antenna into the USB port, similar to ones used with SmartTVs, that would be cool. I'd be able to yank it out and mitigate the risk of being hacked, and/or split the USB jack so I could also access more music, charge other devices, etc.
 
Ingineer said:
Don't count on Automakers to ever add recent tech innovations to their the cars. Sadly, it appears this will always be up to the aftermarket. I am working on some solutions...
Presume you are exploring being able to communicate with the LEAF over a local network, and get-send info and commands from some type of browser interface ? Simple things like start and stop charging, climate control, etc., with the end result of avoiding a carwings subscription?
 
garygid said:
There are some security issues, I believe.

Absolutely.
Cellular networks = secure (for various reasons)
WiFi/Bluetooth/other protocols that work in "unlicensed" (public) spectrum = NOT secure (except to the novice)

While I too would like a "free" option to talk to my Leaf, I don't want to sacrifice security.
 
I hadn't considered the Carwings subscription issue, in that its provided free with my 3 year lease. I'm sure a simple workaround would suffice. Nonetheless, I think its probably just a pretty simple and minor firmware upgrade to the onboard nav-system that may enable a wifi interface, using a 3rd party USB-wifi antenna.

Even so and given the risks, how much security is needed to activate a charge timer, or climate control?... Seriously, this isn't as if we're enabling some form of identity theft, or nuclear reaction. Maybe security is a major concern in some areas, but where I live in the PNW, I could care less, one way another, about my Carwing's telemetry being breached. Why would it matter anyway?

I'm guessing the Bluetooth licensing agreement with Nissan may possibly prohibiting the implementation of a more efficient and practical wifi alternative. As such, if there were a wifi option, Bluetooth might otherwise become an obsolete technology.
 
Stanton said:
Absolutely.
Cellular networks = secure (for various reasons)
WiFi/Bluetooth/other protocols that work in "unlicensed" (public) spectrum = NOT secure (except to the novice)

While I too would like a "free" option to talk to my Leaf, I don't want to sacrifice security.
Please explain to me how a cellular connection is "secure" while a WPA2 WiFi connection is not? I bet I can glean an order of magnitude more data surreptitiously from your mobile than you'll ever be able to get from my secure WiFi network!

In any event, as it stands right now the only tough security you have to breach in order to gain control of the "extremely dangerous" charging and climate features of your LEAF is a simple login and password. With the bulk of people out there using easy to crack passwords, any perceived security on the link is lost. Security is only as good as it's weakest link.

Sadly, carwings doesn't offer much in the way of interesting features for someone to want to gain access to. You can't even unlock the doors or locate your car! This makes high-level security protocols unneeded.
 
Ingineer said:
I really wish they would simply add a firewalled head unit running Android and open it up to the free market Android ecosystem. This would solve the problem while also removing the burden of innovating in this area so they can concentrate their resources on doing what they do best; building cars, while leaving the infotainment innovation to an industry that can move faster.
Interesting that you think it's this simple. No matter which platform they tried to integrate, it would add a significant amount of complexity to the system and cause a lot more problems than it solves.
 
Stanton said:
garygid said:
There are some security issues, I believe.
While I too would like a "free" option to talk to my Leaf, I don't want to sacrifice security.

Then you guys can keep it turned off. ;)

Will Carwings or whatever be around in 10 years? It would be nice to have an alternative.
 
ampitupco said:
Will Carwings or whatever be around in 10 years? It would be nice to have an alternative.

Yes: the fancy term for this sort of thing is "telematics", and it will become MORE prevalent with all types of transportation as time goes on. The Leaf's TCU can/will be upgraded from 2G -> 3G (and eventually 4G) cellular systems to maintain it's connectivity. In other words, they can keep the same server/app/whatever forever (although I hope they don't), but eventually they will be forced to upgrade the wireless interface used in the vehicle. The question is when/how much it will cost (us?) to do that and what functionality they will maintain/offer.
 
Stanton said:
... The Leaf's TCU can/will be upgraded from 2G -> 3G (and eventually 4G) cellular systems to maintain it's connectivity. In other words, they can keep the same server/app/whatever forever (although I hope they don't), but eventually they will be forced to upgrade the wireless interface used in the vehicle. The question is when/how much it will cost (us?) to do that and what functionality they will maintain/offer.
I suspect the answer is more likely to be that they will NEVER offer comm upgrades to the existing LEAFs. When/if the cell network stops supporting our cars, we just lose telematics entirely, I bet.
 
Since they apparently have not been keeping up with cellular systems,the 2014 leaf came with a notice that AT&T would be discontinuing the service they used in less than the 3 year included Carwings subscription time. The cars should have been coming with 3G/4G radios by now.

Remember, older GM cars with analog cellphone connections for OnStar had similar problems when analog cellular was discontinued.
 
But at least GM offered an update kit for said vehicles and included it in the price of a one year subscription to Onstar...

alanlarson said:
Remember, older GM cars with analog cellphone connections for OnStar had similar problems when analog cellular was discontinued.
 
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