phev dominance

after owning both a bev & a phev I must lean towards the phev as a practical car for the masses.I like new & efficient products.The bev takes to much of a hit on so many fronts.The phev is the future in my opinion.

Paging Jennifer Lawrence...

asimba2 said:

Paging Jennifer Lawrence...

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don't get it?

epic said:

after owning both a bev & a phev I must lean towards the phev as a practical car for the masses.I like new & efficient products.The bev takes to much of a hit on so many fronts.The phev is the future in my opinion.

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You are welcome to your opinion.
After owning and driving both, I will never go back.
ICE is history, PHEV is present, BEV is the future IMO

It is all a matter of the right tool for the right job.

It's true when you put a volt next to a model S you can make a very cogent argument for why gm didn't try to solve the last 10% of the problem.

I don't want anything to do with ICEs ever again. Electric motors are just so much better. It's time for the 19th century technology of the ICE to join the buggy whip and the typewriter in the annals of history.

But seriously, if a BEV does not work in your particular situation, I agree that for now a PHEV is the lesser evil. It's a stopgap technology that will disappear once BEV's have range similar to ICEs.

epic said:

The phev is the future in my opinion.

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The PHEV's future is now. It's the crutch that short range EVs need to be useful transportation tools. But as battery range increases, and rapid charge infrastructure continues to grow, the need for an onboard generator will eventually become nonexistent. When you put a PHEV against a BEV with 265 mile range and SC stations every 200 miles, the PHEV loses its advantage.

Gas is an amazing super energy dense wonder- but it won't be the transportation fuel choice for ever. BEVs are the future, we just need some time to get there.

Perfect timing. I just wrote this article yesterday:

http://insideevs.com/op-ed-all-electric-vs-plug-in-hybrid/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

adric22 said:

Perfect timing. I just wrote this article yesterday:

http://insideevs.com/op-ed-all-electric-vs-plug-in-hybrid/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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got a lot of responces on the well written article.

the heat is a huge issue with the leaf.It completely kills the range.And i'm in texas. the energI will cook you out of the car with the ice,then go back to ev.

adric22 said:

Perfect timing. I just wrote this article yesterday:

http://insideevs.com/op-ed-all-electric-vs-plug-in-hybrid/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Well written article!
Although I disagree with the conclusion.

If I agreed with your initial assumptions I would also agree with the conclusion.

Right up front though you qualify that you are looking at a 10-20 year timeframe.
Assuming affordable EVs will have a 70-80 mile range in that timeframe is not one I agree with.

adric22 said:

Perfect timing. I just wrote this article yesterday:

http://insideevs.com/op-ed-all-electric-vs-plug-in-hybrid/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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....My predictions are based on a few assumptions, such as:
All affordable BEVs will have a EPA driving range between 70 and 80 miles.
Batteries don’t become significantly cheaper or smaller than they are now.
Charging station infrastructure, especially DC fast charging infrastructure continues to grow at the snail’s pace...

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Your three improbable assumptions have led you to your one improbable prediction.

...I’m going to make a prediction that the PHEV will start outselling the BEV by significant margins in the coming years...

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There's another factor I should have put in there but forgot... That's government incentives. Once they run out, a 20-mile PHEV will be the cheapest plug-in car for most people to afford. Right now the government is basically paying for the battery so the bigger battery is better.

PHEV's wont dominate in sales number, but will in product variety
EV's will stay Tesla/Nissan dominated

when Tesla/Nissan close the gap, (150mile LEAF, Gen III Tesla) then PHEVs will really feel the heat. But by then there will many midsize PHEV (Sonata/Altima etc)


January should've been a better month for PHEVs than EVs due to the cold weather
but EVs were 1st and 2nd place
then PHEVs 3,4,5
then miscellaneous

expect this to roughly continue for 2014

ydnas7 said:

January should've been a better month for PHEVs than EVs due to the cold weather

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Can you explain that logic? States? Not very many car buyers of anytime when the weather is downright frigid.

I guess I feel there is room for both types of vehicles. BEVs are the perfect commuter vehicle and the range, cost and battery life issues will not dog them for too many more years. PHEVs, including FCEVs, will likely always be around since they likely will find some applications which they can address better than, albeit at a slightly higher cost and lower efficiency.

RegGuheert said:

I guess I feel there is room for both types of vehicles. BEVs are the perfect commuter vehicle and the range, cost and battery life issues will not dog them for too many more years. PHEVs, including FCEVs, will likely always be around since they likely will find some applications which they can address better than, albeit at a slightly higher cost and lower efficiency.

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what is===fcev==??thanks.new 1 to me

FCEV =fuel cell electric vehicle
example Honda Clarity http://automobiles.honda.com/fcx-clarity/

There is a wave of transition from ICE to Hybrid to PHEV to BEV that will have many stages, but I think the tipping point for all will be when the F150 has an unsubsidized PHEV variant. When the economics make that an affordable feature, and Joe six-pack is on board with plugging in, that will mean cheaper BEVs using the same improved technology and a wide spread charger network where every parking lot nationwide has a place to charge. Better technology and more charging locations floats all boats, PHEV and BEV. Some time in the future Hybrid tech will be so common that getting ICE vehicle will be like finding manual shift today. From Hybrid to PHEV is a short technology gap, so PHEV should also get very common.

No point in debating the merits of the two, they each have advantages depending on the use pattern the the customer needs. I love my Leaf, and this is my second one, but I am very open to a PHEV if it has a 40 mile real world range and a small, efficient, ICE. The second generation Volt has serious potential with a 1 liter 3 cyl engine and more range (if they also improve its looks and quiet its ride).

epic said:

after owning both a bev & a phev I must lean towards the phev as a practical car for the masses.I like new & efficient products.The bev takes to much of a hit on so many fronts.The phev is the future in my opinion.

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PHEVs are simply the same as the public has grown up with and has become totally comfortable with. its an EV without compromise, risk or even perhaps; reward. IOW, it very well could be like your Father's Oldsmobile.

that means its NOT the future because its really just a throwback. its allowing Win 8 to run a 32 bit filing system. IOW; a weak, underpowered workaround to a non issue solely to provide comfort to people who are simply unwilling to change